00:00:02 <bh> The abyssal stair is in, it's just described as a gate.
00:00:03 <faze> there's an ENUM/define for it!
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00:00:25 <DracoOmega> I'd really be tempted to just call it an abyssal stair in-game, too
00:00:33 <faze> hehe
00:00:42 <bh> DracoOmega: if (date == April 1) { abyssal stair } :)
00:00:51 <faze> i like it
00:00:55 <Sizzell> Unstable branch on crawl.s-z.org updated to: 0.12-a0-1702-g7df28bf (34)
00:01:00 <ChrisOelmueller> i have the stairs remapped to hatches, visually
00:01:02 <bh> does crawl ever do easter eggs?
00:01:04 <ChrisOelmueller> least we can do
00:01:09 <faze> make the gate take you to an arena where you are surrounded by 99 cerebovs
00:01:22 <ChrisOelmueller> that is not the correct plural of cerebov :p
00:01:34 <faze> cerebovii?
00:01:41 <ChrisOelmueller> "cerebov"
00:01:43 <faze> haha
00:01:57 <faze> that reminds me of a quote from 'the wire'
00:02:19 -!- shirish has joined ##crawl-dev
00:02:34 <faze> which i will keep to myself ;)
00:03:03 <faze> !seen |amethyst
00:03:03 <Henzell> Sorry faze, I haven't seen amethyst.
00:03:09 <faze> !seen amethyst
00:03:09 <Henzell> Sorry faze, I haven't seen amethyst.
00:03:11 <Gretell> Unstable branch on crawl.develz.org updated to: 0.12-a0-1702-g7df28bf (34)
00:04:12 <faze> i guess i can look at my uncommited patch to turn on show_inventory_weights by default
00:04:44 <bh> DracoOmega: I'm adding a new layout that will be almost entirely empty
00:04:49 <faze> too bad about that tiles bug
00:05:02 <DracoOmega> bh: That doesn't sound that interesting, on the face of it
00:05:09 <faze> Grunt: are you around?
00:05:20 <bh> DracoOmega: except that ~5% of the squares will be walls and it will change very rapidly
00:05:34 <DracoOmega> Oh. Well, perhaps that might be.
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00:06:02 <bh> I can, say, guarantee that 0.5% of the abyss will be like this
00:06:23 <faze> Grunt: i was curious if you would be open to adjust the DEPTH of grunt_rogues_gallery to D:20-26 from D:16-26
00:06:43 <faze> it is really rough on d:16
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00:07:27 <faze> or possibly exclude demonspawn scorchers until d:20?
00:07:40 <faze> i think that was the only particularly troublesome monster
00:07:48 <ChrisOelmueller> even d:20 is tough for that
00:07:51 <faze> yeah
00:07:59 <Cheibriados> demonspawn scorcher (12@) | Spd: 10 | HD: 15 | HP: 57-101 | AC/EV: 2/12 | Dam: 10 | 10weapons, 10items, 10doors, 07vault | Res: 06magic(60) | Vul: 08holy++ | Chunks: 07contam | XP: 1805 | Sp: b.fire (3d24), fireball (3d25), blink, fire storm (8d12), b.magma (3d24) | Sz: Medium | Int: normal.
00:07:59 <faze> %??demonspawn scorcher
00:08:07 <monqy> "That is a grass." reminds me of "A piece of floor" from ancient crawl
00:08:13 <ChrisOelmueller> but on d:20 you at least have a good chance of doing V
00:08:17 <faze> i guess D:21-26 would be better now that vaults can spawn on D:20
00:08:18 <DracoOmega> "A piece of floor. Just one."
00:08:30 <faze> but being placed in Elf is worse
00:08:32 <monqy> ZChris13: what are you doing to dune buggy
00:08:42 <ZChris13> monqy: wrong chat
00:08:43 <ZChris13> ???
00:08:47 <monqy> ???
00:08:50 <monqy> oh
00:08:50 <monqy> yes
00:08:52 <monqy> woops
00:08:55 <monqy> i cant believe i did that
00:09:04 <faze> if fireball was change to b.fire and firestorm to fireball, it'd be a more sane monster
00:09:05 <ZChris13> let's keep talking in this chat and make it worse yes
00:09:25 <faze> but when 2/3rds of a monster's spell are autohit
00:09:28 <faze> it's a bit crazy
00:09:39 <faze> s/spell/spells/
00:11:03 <bh> faze: do any other monsters cast fire storm?
00:11:24 <faze> besides cerebov, panlords and ghosts?
00:11:25 <faze> no
00:11:43 <monqy> maybe a silly vault monster. maybe.
00:11:49 <faze> i wonder if adding
00:11:49 <ChrisOelmueller> well there are more silly rogues
00:11:51 <faze> er
00:12:01 <Cheibriados> deep elf scorcher (12e) | Spd: 10 | HD: 15 | HP: 55-80 | AC/EV: 0/13 | Dam: 12 | 10weapons, 10items, 10doors, spellcaster, see invisible, 07vault | Res: 06magic(120) | Chunks: 07contam | XP: 1603 | Sp: b.fire (3d24), fireball (3d25), blink, fire storm (8d12), b.magma (3d24) | Sz: Medium | Int: high.
00:12:01 <ChrisOelmueller> %??deep elf scorcher
00:12:13 <faze> i wonder if adding '}' to the autopickup = line will enable rune autopickup
00:12:19 <faze> i guess there's one way to find out!
00:12:23 <ChrisOelmueller> it will also pick up all misc items
00:12:31 <faze> oh right
00:12:31 <ChrisOelmueller> i have that, and a rune exclusion :)
00:12:34 <faze> hehe
00:13:03 <faze> settings/init.txt doesn't have any autopickup_exclusions in it
00:13:20 <faze> err
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00:14:56 <faze> are there items that use the { glyph?
00:15:13 <faze> oh wait, that is 'possible invisible monster' glyph
00:15:16 <ChrisOelmueller> yup
00:15:25 <faze> and 'underwater maybe monster'
00:15:27 <faze> dangit
00:15:40 <Cheibriados> lightning spire (11{) | Spd: 10 | HD: 3 | HP: 9-24 | AC/EV: 13/3 | 11non-living, !sil | Res: 13magic(immune), 05fire++, 02cold++, 10elec++, 03poison++, 12drown, 04rot+++, 13neg+++, 13torm | XP: 28 | Sp: b.electricity (3d6) | Sz: small | Int: plant.
00:15:40 <ChrisOelmueller> %??lightning spire
00:16:33 <ChrisOelmueller> moving misc items to { might still be feasible
00:16:38 <faze> yeah
00:16:57 <ChrisOelmueller> or at least i wouldn't care
00:16:58 <faze> is the basetype of a rune OBJ_MISCELLANY?
00:17:17 <faze> it looks like it anyway
00:17:29 <faze> well, death cobs are %
00:17:40 <ChrisOelmueller> (base_type == OBJ_MISCELLANY && sub_type == MISC_RUNE_OF_ZOT)
00:17:42 <faze> i guess they are corn cobs, so it kinda makes sense :P
00:18:17 <Cheibriados> 03DracoOmega 07* 0.12-a0-1703-gbbed026: Remove the draining side-effect of lurking horror explosions 10(2 days ago, 1 file, 8+ 12-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=bbed0266e481
00:18:17 <Cheibriados> 03dolorous 07* 0.12-a0-1704-gbdd85bd: Add formatting fix. 10(in the future, 1 file, 0+ 2-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=bdd85bd3ff0d
00:18:28 <Gretell> Windows builds of master branch on crawl.develz.org updated to: 0.12-a0-1702-g7df28bf
00:18:35 <ChrisOelmueller> good future there again
00:18:40 <ChrisOelmueller> %git
00:18:40 <Cheibriados> 03dolorous * 0.12-a0-1704-gbdd85bd: Add formatting fix. 10(in the future, 1 file, 0+ 2-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=bdd85bd3ff0d
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00:18:59 <faze> gentlemen, i give you the future
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00:19:24 <DracoOmega> Haha
00:20:16 <faze> DracoOmega: are you a dubstep fan/a fan of the 1970s movie that sample came from?
00:20:47 <DracoOmega> I am not even certain what you're referring to, so I'm going to guess no
00:20:49 <faze> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=arWouqZf0kk&t=25s
00:20:57 <faze> (sorry for the offtopicness)
00:21:14 <faze> hehe ok
00:21:38 <bh> sometimes I wonder if dolorous is a bot who just fixes errors in crawl
00:21:57 <DracoOmega> Formatbot
00:22:01 <faze> i wonder the same thing about elliptic, if you add /plays after errors
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00:26:07 <faze> i am seeing if adding 'autopickup += 'MISC_RUNE_OF_ZOT';
00:26:16 <faze> to initfile.cc will work
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00:42:10 <bh> did someone check in a bunch of vaults with bad whitespace?
00:43:53 <bh> hm. maybe util/checkwhite lost it
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00:46:29 <faze> bh: i wrote a vault patch recently that modified a few .des files
00:46:39 <faze> what would be considered 'bad whitespace'?
00:46:47 <faze> trailing?
00:47:08 <bh> You have some suspicious patch lines: crawl-ref/source/dat/des/serial/bayou.des + no newline at eof (line 301)
00:47:19 <faze> yeah, i was wondering about that
00:47:31 <faze> was that from my most recent patch?
00:47:36 <bh> unsure
00:47:47 <faze> %git :/chrish
00:47:48 <Cheibriados> Could not find commit :/chrish (git returned 128)
00:47:59 <faze> %git :/known tele
00:48:00 <Cheibriados> Could not find commit :/known tele (git returned 128)
00:48:10 <faze> bleh
00:48:35 <Cheibriados> 03bh 07* 0.12-a0-1705-g868325f: Fix abyss wizmode teleports 10(3 minutes ago, 1 file, 1+ 1-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=868325f05bb1
00:48:35 <Cheibriados> 03bh 07* 0.12-a0-1706-gfb643e2: Abyss: The Wastes 10(3 minutes ago, 3 files, 36+ 14-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=fb643e29a818
00:48:37 <faze> %git 85fca068c8c6
00:48:38 <Cheibriados> 03faze * 0.12-a0-1690-g85fca06: Reveal teleport traps in multiple vaults. 10(2 days ago, 4 files, 8+ 8-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=85fca068c8c6
00:49:24 <bh> I think checkwhite is doing the wrong thing.
00:49:31 <faze> ok
00:49:37 <DracoOmega> 0.0004% sounds INCREDIBLY rare
00:49:40 <ZenArcade> d10 sphinx
00:49:46 <ZenArcade> please fix this vault, whatever it is
00:49:50 <faze> on minifeatures and altar.des, there were those weird 'no newline' things
00:49:58 <faze> ZenArcade: are you playing online?
00:50:00 <ChrisOelmueller> have you tried telling us what the vault is
00:50:01 <DracoOmega> ZenArcade: That's probably just a generic out of depth monster
00:50:13 <ZenArcade> it's avault, and yes
00:50:18 <faze> DracoOmega: it's probably an 8 or 0
00:50:22 <bh> DracoOmega: I can increase the frequency. I mostly put it in so people can test it in wizmode...
00:50:22 <faze> ZenArcade: server/name
00:50:27 <ZenArcade> cao/zenarcade
00:50:30 <DracoOmega> faze: Well, that's what I meant
00:50:30 <faze> ok
00:50:35 <faze> yeah
00:50:37 <DracoOmega> I mean, it's probably not specifically placing a sphinc
00:50:43 <faze> right
00:50:49 <faze> i think zenarcade is aware of that too
00:51:07 <DracoOmega> bh: Well, how about making the frequency high enough that NORMAL people can test it too? :P
00:51:16 <bh> DracoOmega: fine...
00:51:18 <ZenArcade> is it really fair to expect someone to deal with sphinxes on d10
00:51:21 <ZenArcade> is what I'm asking
00:51:23 <faze> ZenArcade: change your putty settings to 80x24/iterm2 settings to 'disable session initiated resizing'
00:51:27 <DracoOmega> ZenArcade: It can be done
00:51:35 <faze> hmm, which vault is that?
00:51:43 <faze> i know i have seen it
00:51:43 <ZenArcade> 80x25 is bigterm?
00:51:47 <DracoOmega> ZenArcade: Running away is of course how many people would reasonably deal with it, though
00:51:52 <ZenArcade> i'm chie
00:51:54 <ZenArcade> haha
00:51:55 <faze> technically, but it doesn't actually mess up footv
00:52:08 <DracoOmega> ZenArcade: Well, then it's your own fault :P
00:52:12 <faze> hahaha
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00:52:20 <ZenArcade> I want a chei win :|
00:52:21 <faze> that is a rough situation
00:52:29 <ZenArcade> I have to read id blink here
00:52:40 <faze> you still might die anyways
00:52:40 <DracoOmega> Yes, I have definitely encountered a couple sphinxes at a similar depth myself
00:52:48 <DracoOmega> Very rarely, of course
00:52:50 <ZenArcade> didn't work
00:52:57 <bh> DracoOmega: done. 0.3%
00:53:11 <ChrisOelmueller> okay this is not ##crawl but you should really know your scrolls on d:10
00:53:20 <faze> ZenArcade: did you die in the vault?
00:53:24 <ZenArcade> yeah
00:53:25 <ChrisOelmueller> and yes the vault might be a bit over the top
00:53:26 <faze> !lg zenarcade x=map
00:53:26 <Sequell> 1168. [map=minmay diamond stairs] ZenArcade the Marksminotaur (L11 MiHu), worshipper of Cheibriados, blown up by a great orb of eyes on D:10 (minmay diamond stairs) on 2013-01-20 06:52:43, with 8722 points after 10720 turns and 0:22:11.
00:53:28 <faze> ok
00:53:31 <bh> ChrisOelmueller: maybe we should just auto-id all your scrolls when you reach D:10 ;)
00:53:35 <ZenArcade> I got instantly paraslowed when I walked in
00:53:39 <Cheibriados> 03bh 07* 0.12-a0-1707-g0ae31d5: Abyss: More Wastes 10(77 seconds ago, 1 file, 4+ 4-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=0ae31d5ae7bd
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00:53:44 <ZenArcade> because sphinx/great orb/chei move
00:53:50 <ChrisOelmueller> that would be chei more than any vault, yes
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00:54:38 <ZenArcade> so 80x25 messes up termcast?
00:54:44 <faze> ZenArcade: slightly
00:54:52 <ZenArcade> I went back to 24
00:55:03 <faze> the last line of the message area gets overwritten, but it doesn't scroll
00:55:25 <faze> 8s on d:8-d:13 are kinda shitty imo
00:55:31 <faze> i've seen d:10 liches
00:55:34 <ChrisOelmueller> it messes up casting a tad more if you use small_more
00:55:35 <DracoOmega> I sort of like them, actually
00:55:38 <faze> i mean, it's easy to survive as not chei
00:55:41 <DracoOmega> Like, they're scary but that's not
00:55:44 <faze> DracoOmega: right
00:55:45 <DracoOmega> that's nice*
00:55:57 <faze> but certain characters have a large chance of dying
00:56:00 <faze> chei, naga, etc
00:56:11 <faze> that's just crawl i guess
00:56:15 <DracoOmega> I'm not sure that's something that can be easily addressed, since that's true of a lot of circumstances
00:56:18 <DracoOmega> With slow movement
00:56:20 <faze> indeed
00:56:24 <ChrisOelmueller> that's the way crawl is telling you to not be there as that character, or have means of escaping
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00:56:30 <faze> yeah
00:56:42 <ZenArcade> I did dig into that vault so
00:56:44 <faze> i don't think its unfair, it just forces you to move on
00:56:48 <ZenArcade> I was asking for something
00:56:57 <ZenArcade> buuut I didn't necessarily want that
00:57:00 <DracoOmega> Like, some of my favorite times in Crawl are when I run into serious out of depth stuff and somehow manage to kill it
00:57:03 <faze> ZenArcade: well, then i blame you 100% :P
00:57:09 <elliptic> !vault minmay_diamond_stairs
00:57:09 <Henzell> Lines pasted to http://pastie.org/5732040
00:57:09 <faze> DracoOmega: yeah, same
00:57:11 <DracoOmega> Like that pair of yaktaur captains on D:9 or something that one time....
00:58:34 <ChrisOelmueller> greensnark: i believe displaying the kmap/map vault with underscores instead of spaces would enhance its usability, would you object to such a change?
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00:58:54 <ChrisOelmueller> mostly because both !vault and edit_vault in crawl don't know about spaces though i guess
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01:01:17 <Lightli> zzz
01:01:20 <Lightli> oops
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01:43:56 <mumra> i for one disapprove of rune autopickup. it's nice standing on the rune and savouring the moment of pressing the pickup key (particularly the harder runes). maybe there should be a prompt "You see here a slimy rune. Pick up the rune? y/n"
01:44:48 <ChrisOelmueller> %git :/want to
01:44:48 <Cheibriados> 03kilobyte * 0.12-a0-1420-g99cd16b: Remove "Are you sure you want to win?". 10(5 weeks ago, 1 file, 2+ 8-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=99cd16b7b6f6
01:44:54 <monqy> something about "are you sure you want to --dang!!!
01:45:29 <ontoclasm> that got removed? how sad
01:45:31 <ChrisOelmueller> monqy: sorry for snatching that!!
01:46:07 <mumra> basically i don't feel like the game should be doing *everything* for me, especially not important things. otherwise there might as well not be a player. (i am starting to feel this way about autotargetting when i see some discussion about finding the most optimal possible default target for all conjurations)
01:47:35 <ChrisOelmueller> that'd be me too
01:48:20 <monqy> also remove autoexplore/autotravel because tedious and easily automatable tasks are fun and immersive
01:48:31 <mumra> :)
01:48:39 <mumra> is picking up a rune tedious?
01:48:48 <monqy> i'm extrapolating!!!
01:49:09 <mumra> heh
01:49:10 <ChrisOelmueller> autopickup not getting it for you after fighting the entire level is, yes
01:49:14 <monqy> but targetting can be tedious
01:49:22 <ChrisOelmueller> especially if you are a player not knowing that you want to pick it up
01:49:47 <ChrisOelmueller> i'm pretty sure we all know how to disable it (even possible in-game now)
01:49:55 <ChrisOelmueller> but they wouldn't know how to enable
01:50:07 <mumra> yeah but targetting is an important tactical part of the game where as a human you have to make decisions and stuff, at least with area spells and the like
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01:50:29 <monqy> see also autofight though
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01:50:35 <monqy> in the common case it really doesn't matter what choice you make
01:51:04 <mumra> yeah, that's why i don't mind simple autotargetting (e.g. nearest monster) but against a crowd i will always want to optimise the beam manually
01:51:23 <mumra> and i think it's impossible to come up with an ai that could predict exactly where you want to target every time
01:51:56 <monqy> of course; the idea would be to use reasonable heuristics to guess reasonably and get it right most of the time
01:52:06 <nicolae-> grab a goodplayer and upload their consciousness into the program
01:52:39 <mumra> then they might start arguing with you and shouting at you for making mistakes
01:53:06 <nicolae-> good call. we should take away their ability to do that. i have no mouth and i must scream (at you for training the wrong skills)
01:56:22 <mumra> the thing is for a new player, finding a rune is a defining moment, and automatically picking it up for me would take away some of the magic (maybe i'm just sentimental). how many players *don't* know that they want to pick it up once they've played the game long enough to reach a branch end?
01:57:43 <mumra> all i'm saying is: there has to be a line somewhere where the game is no longer reduced to a bot, otherwise we end up with a single user interaction which is "do you want to start the game? y/n"
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02:19:31 <Cheibriados> 03ontoclasm 07* 0.12-a0-1708-g713c394: Lugonu invoc tile edits 10(2 minutes ago, 3 files, 0+ 0-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=713c394eb333
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02:44:48 <Henzell> crate the Impregnable (L13 MiFi) ASSERT(!at_branch_bottom()) in 'stairs.cc' at line 533 failed on turn 4179. (Abyss)
02:47:09 <ChrisOelmueller> !tell bh <crate> cant dive abyss in sprint <Henzell> crate the Impregnable (L13 MiFi) ASSERT(!at_branch_bottom()) in 'stairs.cc' at line 533 failed on turn 4179. (Abyss)
02:47:09 <Henzell> ChrisOelmueller: OK, I'll let bh know.
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04:40:54 <Cheibriados> 03ontoclasm 07* 0.12-a0-1709-gd40ebff: Additional blood edits 10(3 minutes ago, 11 files, 10+ 10-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=d40ebff133a3
04:43:26 <elliott> there's a better reason to not autopickup runes than just immersion
04:44:45 <ChrisOelmueller> haha, yes
04:44:52 <ChrisOelmueller> but that doesn't involve most players either
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04:56:04 <Cheibriados> 03ontoclasm 07* 0.12-a0-1710-g17fa88b: Bone tiles 10(13 seconds ago, 9 files, 2+ 0-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=17fa88bde659
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05:23:40 <frogbotherer> !messages
05:23:40 <Henzell> No messages for frogbotherer.
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06:11:07 <mumra> Can I show you all some WIP layouts for newnewvaults ...
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06:11:14 <mumra> This layout code: http://pastebin.com/PXj5yDnC
06:11:35 <mumra> Will do all this kind of thing: http://pastebin.com/RBC9hhK3
06:12:29 <ChrisOelmueller> ooh
06:12:34 <mumra> (These are outputs from internal debugging print; the more interesting layouts are getting veto'd (I think because of lack of transparent on the rellay complex subvaults of the original newvaults vaults)
06:12:34 <ChrisOelmueller> are all those + doors?
06:12:48 <mumra> The + show connecting walls, they will contain doors, but it won't be a whole wall of door no
06:12:57 <ChrisOelmueller> ah, i see :)
06:13:26 <mumra> The commas are where room vaults are placed, the other rooms are empty (but the dungeon builder could place other standard vaults in them if it likes)
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06:15:29 <mumra> This one is omnicross: http://pastebin.com/CaCPC0cD
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06:18:38 <mumra> And this one is equivalent of newvaults square ring layout: http://pastebin.com/pBV7vyjh
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06:19:24 <mumra> (There's a max depth setting to stop rooms getting so deeply nested and mazey but at the moment i'm experimenting)
06:20:05 <ChrisOelmueller> does current ring layout have the center filled?
06:20:24 <mumra> There are two versions - one is like omnibox, the other has the center filled like this
06:20:52 <mumra> Sometimes it uses one very large vault in the center (which is also possible in the new one)
06:22:15 <mumra> These layouts can potentially create everything current vaults does, but there are far more permutations
06:22:55 <elliott> mumra: these layouts look pretty cool
06:23:12 <mumra> Well, it will never create the "even grid" layout, because the rooms are never all one size
06:23:43 <elliott> do you ever get a square level that has a "border" like V:5 does? it looks like these all have rooms jutting out of them to some degree, might be nice to have a more "regular"-sized level once in a while
06:23:44 <mumra> elliott: cheers! you can see a lot of floor vault here
06:23:55 <elliott> hehe, yes
06:23:57 <ChrisOelmueller> <3 floor vault
06:24:07 <mumra> elliott: i can easily make that layout, give me 5 mins
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06:33:40 <mumra> i am starting to really hate lua. would love a scripting language with actual syntax checking
06:33:48 <mumra> e.g. javascript
06:39:40 <mumra> aha
06:39:53 <mumra> elliott: here's V:5 layout with free bonus: http://pastebin.com/jRekLZwp
06:40:17 <elliott> looks very cool
06:40:23 <elliott> interested to see how it looks in-game
06:40:26 <mumra> the first one is traditional quadrants, the rest are subdivided more (up to 4x4 quadrants)
06:40:46 <elliott> it seems to leave a lot of empty space in the quadrants, is that intentional?
06:41:11 <ChrisOelmueller> really looking forward to testing this
06:41:14 <mumra> the only code i wrote to implement the layout was this: http://pastebin.com/vtUhVUYJ
06:41:41 <mumra> (i was meaning to code this one at some point anyway)
06:42:30 <mumra> elliott: which empty space are you talking about, the floor vault or the empty walls? (floor vaults are periods)
06:43:20 <elliott> the space in the quadrants that are just walls, yes
06:44:43 <alefury> mumra: nice!
06:45:25 <mumra> elliott: not entirely intentional, there is a bug right now that's stopping rooms attaching sometimes (so e.g. some of the maze layouts should be spreading around the map more) but i haven't tracked it down yet
06:45:40 <mumra> elliott: but sometimes it's just because it can't find a room small enough to fit the space
06:46:35 <elliott> yeah
06:46:53 <elliott> it could help to just fill the space with "generic" rooms sometimes
06:47:01 <mumra> at the moment i think i have min room size at like 5x5 or 6x6 to avoid enclosed spaces
06:47:07 <elliott> even if they're just empty (or maybe place items or something?)
06:47:30 <mumra> well the floor vaults are for "generic" rooms, they can be generated any size within min/max and contain floor
06:47:46 <mumra> but the rng can and will choose to put items and monsters in them
06:48:03 <elliott> right
06:49:13 <mumra> on those layouts there are very few areas i can see with a 6x6 empty space
06:50:40 <elliott> e.g. the first and last ones in http://pastebin.com/jRekLZwp seem to have lots of empty space that might be better filled somehow
06:51:26 <mumra> oh yeah true. that first one has 20 rooms which is the current max, so the layout didn't try to place any more
06:52:09 <mumra> all parameters like max rooms and min/max room sizes and be changed on a per-layout basis by passing in an options dictionary
06:52:34 <elliott> mm
06:52:40 <mumra> at the moment i don't want to set max rooms too high because the layout builder gets rather slow (until i've done some planned optimisation)
06:52:47 <elliott> ah
06:52:51 <mumra> alefury: thanks btw!
06:52:56 <elliott> seems like if it's fast enough then you wouldn't really need a limit, yeah
06:53:09 <mumra> well it has to stop trying at some point
06:53:29 <elliott> right
06:54:11 <mumra> it's difficult to determine algorithmically whether there is definitely no space left, so it will keep trying randomly from a list of potential coords until it has failed a given number of times
06:54:24 <mumra> at the moment the list of potential coords is "everywhere on the map" which is the thing i need to optimise :)
06:55:26 <mumra> also, on some layouts (e.g. the mazey ones) i don't actually want to fill the entire map with rooms, it would end up silly and take far too long to explore
06:55:45 <mumra> ~20 rooms seems like a generally quite good number to me
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07:14:32 <elliott> pfft, how hard can box packing possibly be!!!
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07:36:15 <mumra> well, it would be easier if i can track down these box connecting bugs first :) and i just spotted a massive clue
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07:46:00 <alefury> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lcHy8xEt2QI
07:46:23 <alefury> (raging clue)
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07:51:48 <mumra> classic
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08:38:26 <Cheibriados> 03dolorous 07* 0.12-a0-1711-ge58b057: Add formatting fixes, and make one function static. 10(in the future, 1 file, 5+ 3-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=e58b0577a6a1
08:38:28 <Cheibriados> Randomly fails to start on Windows 8 (https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=6551) by mumra
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08:58:39 <Cheibriados> 03kilobyte 07* 0.12-a0-1712-g8811394: Don't let abyssals follow you out of the Abyss. 10(27 hours ago, 1 file, 1+ 0-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=8811394ea52c
08:58:39 <Cheibriados> 03kilobyte 07* 0.12-a0-1713-g895ea41: Delete an unused function and related enums. 10(23 hours ago, 3 files, 0+ 15-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=895ea411bbe8
08:58:39 <Cheibriados> 03kilobyte 07* 0.12-a0-1714-g7be5cb3: Rename WM_* to WME_*, because Windows. 10(23 hours ago, 4 files, 44+ 52-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=7be5cb3070d0
08:58:39 <Cheibriados> 03kilobyte 07* 0.12-a0-1715-g04dd302: Fix a bunch of compiler warnings in tiles. 10(23 hours ago, 3 files, 4+ 5-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=04dd302ff264
09:04:19 <ChrisOelmueller> kilobyte: could you perhaps try and give a line or two with such changes
09:04:29 <ChrisOelmueller> not everybody is following all of ##crawl-dev
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09:13:49 <Cheibriados> 03dolorous 07* 0.12-a0-1716-g4a6a273: Remove redundancy: spatial maelstroms are abyssal. 10(30 seconds ago, 1 file, 0+ 1-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=4a6a2734e7b0
09:14:31 <ChrisOelmueller> especially since now there are two potential things to revert
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09:15:59 <mumra> they look self-descriptive enough to me, i don't really see what else could be added
09:16:30 <ChrisOelmueller> i'm missing the reason why
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09:35:23 <mumra> How can I check which vault is used in a particular grid square?
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09:39:06 <kilobyte> mumra: you need to compile in debug mode, then use x
09:39:06 <Henzell> kilobyte: You have 3 messages. Use !messages to read them.
09:39:53 <mumra> ah thanks, knew there was a way
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09:51:31 <faze> is anyone around familiar with how and when spell_slot user definitions are applied?
09:51:51 <faze> from the way it works, i assume they are only checked on spell memorization
09:54:55 <elliptic> faze: they are only checked on spell memorization, yes
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09:55:26 <faze> elliptic: i shall change that
09:55:48 <faze> or should i just write a lua function that the 6 people who would actually use it could put in their rcfile
09:55:59 <faze> the only time i would use that would be dieselrobin
09:56:25 <elliptic> faze: if you mean checking every time you save and reload the game, that seems like a pretty terrible idea to me
09:56:49 <elliptic> because people will manually switch their spell slots
09:56:53 <elliptic> I do this all the time
09:57:08 <faze> ah, right
09:57:10 <elliptic> and also spell slots can conflict and then the order in which you handle the different spells matters
09:57:23 <elliptic> and you just don't want to be changing people's spells where the rcfile *didn't* change
09:57:32 <faze> iirc, you can bind a lua function with a key?
09:57:37 <blackcustard> yes
09:57:40 <faze> to a key, rather
09:57:47 <blackcustard> a macro that starts with "===<lua function name"
09:57:53 <faze> ah, cool
09:57:56 <blackcustard> s/"/>"/
09:58:04 <faze> then i will just write a lua function to do that
09:58:16 <faze> elliptic: are there any functions bound to keys in parabolic?
09:58:49 <elliptic> faze: you can't bind functions to keys in the rcfile
09:59:02 <elliptic> you have to make a macro in-game to do that
09:59:21 <elliptic> the function is in the rcfile but it just looks like a generic lua function
09:59:32 <faze> ah ok
09:59:47 <elliptic> (it would be nice if you could set up lua macros in the rcfile if you want to implement that)
09:59:53 <faze> haha
10:00:04 <faze> possibly after i learn lua :P
10:00:25 <faze> i assume i would need to modify the clua implementation
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10:01:06 <elliott> you wouldn't have to modify lua itself
10:01:10 <faze> elliptic: do you have to edit the raw macros file to do it?
10:01:14 <elliott> there's even a stub function ready for implementing
10:01:19 <faze> elliott: ah
10:01:21 <elliott> but it involves deep dark secrets of the crawl macro system
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10:01:28 <faze> well, my c++ is quite poor too :P
10:01:28 <elliott> which is why it has sat unimplemented since 2006 (or was it 2007)
10:01:31 <faze> right
10:01:31 <elliott> it's still bound to lua though!
10:01:34 <faze> haha
10:01:36 <elliptic> faze: or you can set the macro in-game as normal
10:01:49 <faze> hm, ok
10:01:50 <elliptic> with ~
10:02:12 <faze> i only use macros in 2 circumstances
10:02:31 <faze> lvl1 spell on a character that starts with a lvl 1 attack spell
10:02:39 <faze> to spacebar
10:02:44 <elliott> spacebar, really
10:02:49 <faze> yeah
10:02:53 <faze> i am lazy
10:03:06 <faze> and i ignore most --more-- messages anyways :P
10:03:55 <faze> elliptic: ~k ?
10:04:26 <elliott> faze: you should use squarelosrc then
10:04:33 <elliptic> what is k?
10:04:37 <absolutego> faze: i just macroed ===toggle_explore to z
10:04:40 <absolutego> nothing else
10:04:45 <elliptic> you just make a completely normal macro, yes
10:04:54 <faze> oh, just ~d?
10:04:56 <elliptic> except that the action begins with ===
10:04:59 <faze> absolutego: ah ok
10:05:07 <faze> elliptic: cool
10:05:34 <absolutego> faze: unless you were talking about other things
10:05:37 <absolutego> in which case ignore me
10:06:32 <elliott> faze: just ~m?
10:08:51 <faze> oh right
10:08:58 <faze> i usually use ^dd
10:09:01 <faze> er
10:09:03 <faze> ^d
10:09:23 <faze> i rebound caps to ctrl because really, who uses the caps lock key
10:09:28 <absolutego> i use ^d too
10:09:36 <absolutego> i use the caps lock when i comment-swear
10:09:38 <absolutego> i do it a lot
10:09:39 <Grunt> ^dd, for the overly controlling deep dwarves amongst us?
10:09:40 <elliott> i use caps lock a lot
10:09:43 <elliott> you should try yelling more
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10:19:19 * bh pokes kilobyte with a stick
10:23:06 * bh pokes kilobyte with a fire crab
10:24:14 * Grunt pokes bh with an apocalypse crab.
10:24:35 <Grunt> bh, I was thinking about creating a chaos butterfly as an abyssal enemy. :b
10:25:01 <bh> Grunt: great. Then we can make an Undead Bear that Worships Xom who summons them
10:25:01 <Henzell> bh: You have 1 message. Use !messages to read it.
10:25:03 <bh> !messages
10:25:04 <Henzell> (1/1) ChrisOelmueller said (7h 37m 55s ago): <crate> cant dive abyss in sprint <Henzell> crate the Impregnable (L13 MiFi) ASSERT(!at_branch_bottom()) in 'stairs.cc' at line 533 failed on turn 4179. (Abyss)
10:25:39 <bh> !tell crate You possibly shouldn't be able to dive the abyss in sprint. I can disable it.
10:25:39 <Henzell> bh: OK, I'll let crate know.
10:26:08 <kilobyte> bh: meow?
10:27:00 <elliott> why not just disable sprint abyss
10:27:03 <elliott> it barely exists anyway
10:27:06 <elliott> since no xp, items,
10:27:08 <kilobyte> elliott: +1000
10:27:10 <elliott> rune,
10:27:39 <bh> elliott: bigger patch
10:27:58 <kilobyte> bh: a heart-shaped stare gaze attack?
10:28:00 <bh> kilobyte: as you might have gathered from mantis, I disagree with your corruption changes
10:28:08 <bh> ??
10:28:21 <bh> oh. the abyssfly
10:28:42 <kilobyte> I mean the bear.
10:29:58 <bh> kilobyte: let's not talk about the bear. I had been planning on slipping him in bit-by-bit (0 or 1 bits)
10:30:33 <kilobyte> bh: use a range coder to slip in fractions of bits :p
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11:09:58 <bh> kilobyte: I'd like to see DracoOmega's patch (or something like it) go in
11:10:08 <Grunt> bh: which patch?
11:10:27 <bh> Grunt: Lugonu protecting you from nasty effects from Eldritch monsters
11:10:37 <Grunt> I like that idea.
11:10:38 <MarvinPA> i was going to just shorten the list of abyss-only a bit, as was suggested on the mantis issue
11:10:39 <ChrisOelmueller> the one folks are ignoring and ruining for a few days now
11:11:05 <MarvinPA> will probably push that after i merge this other stuff
11:11:13 <Grunt> What other stuff?
11:11:15 <MarvinPA> abyss-only monsters*
11:11:20 <MarvinPA> vehumet other stuff!
11:11:23 <Grunt> Aha.
11:11:24 <Grunt> :)
11:11:36 <bh> The only gap I've seen in Draco's patch is there's no message about it on the god screen
11:11:48 <Grunt> That's fairly easily fixed.
11:11:53 <bh> yep
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11:29:00 <alefury> i like marvinpa's idea of a shorter banlist
11:29:13 <alefury> it really makes no sense at all for lugonu to protect you from stuff
11:30:19 <Cheibriados> 03ldierk 07* 0.11-a0-909-g2746758: vehumet implemented with a duration and a slightly better spell choosing algorithm. still no saving, and a lot of other // TODO: 's 10(11 months ago, 11 files, 199+ 33-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=2746758bcaa0
11:30:19 <Cheibriados> 03MarvinPA 07* 0.11-a0-910-ge192c41: Whitespace fixes 10(10 months ago, 6 files, 109+ 92-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=e192c41c2979
11:30:19 <Cheibriados> 03MarvinPA 07* 0.11-a0-911-ga31dea8: Vehumet wording/description tweaks 10(10 months ago, 7 files, 21+ 16-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=a31dea80190f
11:30:19 <Cheibriados> 03galehar 07* 0.11-a0-2230-gfd0e49c: Merge branch 'master' into vehumet 10(7 months ago, files, + -) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=fd0e49cbea01
11:30:19 <Cheibriados> 03galehar 07* 0.11-a0-2231-gfb605cc: Save Vehumet gifting data. 10(7 months ago, 2 files, 20+ 0-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=fb605cc96d5c
11:30:19 <Cheibriados> 03galehar 07* 0.11-a0-2232-g734513d: Indentation fix. 10(7 months ago, 1 file, 3+ 3-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=734513d70465
11:30:19 <Cheibriados> 03galehar 07* 0.11-a0-2233-g05d7c05: Use a list instead of an array to store Vehumet's recent gifts. 10(7 months ago, 5 files, 17+ 38-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=05d7c051ce56
11:30:19 <Cheibriados> 03galehar 07* 0.11-a0-2234-g38c4a57: Shorten a variable's name. 10(7 months ago, 5 files, 19+ 19-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=38c4a571b6ee
11:30:19 <Cheibriados> 03MarvinPA 07* 0.11-a0-2235-gf2ed529: Make Vehumet accept demon and holy kills, don't accept ally kills 10(10 months ago, 3 files, 8+ 23-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=f2ed529e6b31
11:30:19 <Cheibriados> 03MarvinPA 07* 0.11-a0-2236-g24d4d3b: Adjust some spell gifting messages 10(7 months ago, 1 file, 6+ 4-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=24d4d3b66f89
11:30:19 <Cheibriados> ... and 30 more commits
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11:30:23 <bh> alefury: why not? "You become attuned to the abyss"
11:30:25 <alefury> allowing maelstroms but making them fade back into the abyss like bh suggested also sounds interesting
11:30:41 <alefury> bh: lugunu wants to corrupt stuff, why would she protect you?
11:30:57 <alefury> anyway, holy crap vehumet! :D
11:30:59 <MarvinPA> oh man, old commits
11:31:00 <bh> alefury: why would lugonu let you depart the abyss?
11:31:07 <alefury> so you can corrupt other places
11:31:14 <alefury> youre no use to her in the abyss
11:31:26 <bh> alefury: exactly. If you're sick and mutated it will be harder for you to spread discord :)
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11:32:13 <alefury> bh: the way i see it, lugonu is a fan of any and all corruption. if you become corrupted, thats fine too.
11:32:49 <alefury> besides, lucy is fine with you dying, so caring about mutations and sickness seems a bit arbitrary
11:32:52 <Grunt> MarvinPA: \o/
11:33:01 <alefury> also, only a few select sources of mutations and sickness...
11:33:22 <bh> alefury: which seems similar to lucy not sending you annoying monsters
11:33:42 <alefury> thats less obvious
11:34:12 <alefury> doesnt require a line on the god screen either
11:34:14 <ChrisOelmueller> alefury: i don't get the argument about dying
11:34:36 <alefury> its a counterargument to "if you are mutated and sick you cant corrupt shit"
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11:35:21 <bh> can I channel dpeg here? ;)
11:35:51 <alefury> channel all you want, lucy protecting you from a few select sources of sickness and mutation wont make any more sense
11:36:29 <bh> There's something simpler here: monsters that corruption sends are neutral. If we make the powers examine attitude the problem goes away
11:36:44 <ChrisOelmueller> why are you trying to make sense on flavour instead of looking for what works gameplay-wise
11:36:52 <ChrisOelmueller> that's pretty annoying and missing the point here
11:37:10 <alefury> ChrisOelmueller: just not letting some stuff out of abyss works just as well, if not even better
11:37:19 <bh> alefury: and completely breaks corruption
11:37:25 <MarvinPA> gameplay-wise just excluding the particularly problematic monsters seems fine
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11:37:41 <ChrisOelmueller> alefury: what
11:37:52 <elliott> MarvinPA: those are monsters which seem interesting in a corruption scenario (i.e. when applied to other monsters) though
11:38:01 <elliott> at least some of them
11:38:03 <elliott> zymes probably aren't
11:38:11 <MarvinPA> bh: it got lost in the veh merge so you probably missed it in here but
11:38:12 <MarvinPA> %git HEAD^^
11:38:12 <Cheibriados> 03MarvinPA * 0.12-a0-1717-gd48edd7: Shorten the list of abyss-only monsters 10(62 minutes ago, 3 files, 4+ 9-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=d48edd72c0b6
11:38:19 <alefury> ChrisOelmueller: corruption worked very well gameplay-wise before the addition of new abyssals. so how does only letting it spawn some of them break gameplay?
11:38:49 <ChrisOelmueller> can you please stop horribly misinterpreting me
11:39:07 <alefury> maybe explain what you mean then?
11:39:20 <alefury> because i dont seem to understand you
11:39:25 <elliptic> alefury: it might help if you attributed the correct person with stuff
11:40:05 <elliptic> <bh> alefury: and completely breaks corruption
11:40:17 <alefury> [18:36:46] <ChrisOelmueller> why are you trying to make sense on flavour instead of looking for what works gameplay-wise
11:40:20 <MarvinPA> personally i don't see ancient zymes or wretched stars being at all interesting as a neutral monster, and making them not affect the player while neutral wouldn't change anything there
11:40:36 <MarvinPA> so not spawning them seems just as good if not better than spawning them but having them do nothing
11:40:37 <bh> MarvinPA: thanks. I'll make spatial maelstroms self-banish sometime this weekend
11:40:55 <elliptic> alefury: well that definitely says nothing about "break gameplay"
11:42:01 <elliott> bh: spatial maelstroms can never appear outside of the abyss right now afaik, unless you mean to do that as an alternative
11:42:07 <elliptic> nobody is saying that excluding abyssals will break gameplay, just that having cool new abyss monsters appear in corruption seems sort of desirable
11:42:21 <alefury> cool monsters like zymes
11:42:23 <alefury> -.-
11:42:48 <elliott> couldn't zymes just be removed if everyone is complaining about them in every context
11:42:52 <elliott> seems an orthogonal issue to corruption
11:42:57 <alefury> that sounds great!
11:43:09 <elliptic> what precisely is wrong with zymes?
11:43:12 <MarvinPA> well there's nothing wrong with hostile zymes
11:43:22 <elliptic> it's true they won't do much to monsters
11:43:30 <elliott> well alefury's statement just now read much more as a complaint about zymes in general to me
11:43:33 <elliott> is my only point
11:43:35 <alefury> it is pretty annoying that they sicken you without a chance to do something about it
11:43:56 <bh> are zymes LOS?
11:43:57 <elliptic> why should the player have a chance to do something about everything in crawl
11:44:02 <MarvinPA> you can kill them, or walk away, or cure it
11:44:11 <elliptic> you can even use lichform!
11:44:14 <MarvinPA> haha
11:44:14 <elliott> pretty annoying that kobolds decrease your HP without a chance to do something about it
11:44:30 <bh> elliott: or titans throw rocks at your face!
11:44:35 <elliptic> I do tend to agree with MarvinPA that I don't see zymes being particularly exciting outside abyss
11:44:59 <MarvinPA> titans don't throw rocks but other than that, yes :P
11:45:06 <elliptic> wretched stars and lurking horrors, not much more so probably
11:45:07 <elliott> bh: um...
11:45:09 <bh> er whatever the rock throwing thing
11:45:11 <elliott> right what MarvinPA said
11:45:14 <elliott> cyclopes
11:45:27 <elliptic> so I am happy with the current status after MarvinPA's last commit
11:45:43 <elliott> why are eldritch tentacles in the list
11:45:47 <elliott> do they even spawn
11:45:50 <elliptic> I was wondering that too
11:45:52 <elliott> (if so why)
11:46:12 <elliptic> aren't eldritch tentacles the things that malign gateway makes?
11:46:17 <elliott> yes
11:46:18 <elliptic> if so they definitely aren't abyss-only
11:46:26 <elliott> perhaps a relic of when it was called mons_is_abyssal?
11:46:33 <elliott> i.e. when it was a faux MH_ELDRITCH check
11:46:40 <elliptic> corruption spawning them would be bad, but I hope it wouldn't anyway?
11:46:42 <elliptic> yeah
11:46:48 <elliott> seems like it could just be removed then
11:47:41 <kilobyte> zymes and wretched stars are not intelligent, their light affects allies too, so it'd be strange if they ignored neutrals. Sure, this could be changed, but...
11:47:59 <kilobyte> I agree that the state after MarvinPA's commit is probably the best
11:48:35 <kilobyte> and yeah, I've put eldritch tentacles there not because corruption can pull them in (it can't), but because of the function being faux MH_ELDRITCH
11:48:38 <elliptic> kilobyte: right, I don't know how many of the usual corruption spawns are resistant/immune to zymes/stars
11:48:51 <elliptic> I guess probably most of them can't sicken?
11:48:59 <elliptic> or can demons?
11:49:07 <kilobyte> can't IIRC
11:49:10 <kilobyte> lemme check
11:49:20 <kilobyte> I'm quite sure it can't
11:49:22 <elliott> dracoomega wanted wretched stars not to affect the standard stuff that appears in the abyss, I believe
11:49:26 <elliott> since they are meant to work at pack monsters
11:49:31 <elliott> but I think they currently do?
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11:50:45 <kilobyte> only naturals and plants that don't have MR_RES_ROTTING
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11:54:20 <kilobyte> elliptic: I can't seem to reproduce your crash with bad_forms and self-zapping a wand of polymorph
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12:00:38 <bh> what's the name of the 'how many AUT did you use use?' variable?
12:01:06 <kilobyte> you.time_taken
12:03:40 <elliptic> kilobyte: I'm not at the same computer as the one where I had the crash, but when I am I'll look at the crash dump
12:05:56 <bh> kilobyte: I have maelstroms self-banishing with a probability of 1% per AUT. So on average they should stick around for about 5 turns
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12:06:38 <kilobyte> how do they work in a crowd?
12:07:02 <elliptic> that sounds like average 10 turns to me
12:07:14 <kilobyte> yeah
12:08:08 <Sizzell> Unstable branch on crawl.s-z.org updated to: 0.12-a0-1756-g3270b88 (34)
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12:10:14 <bh> elliptic: 1%/aut, 10 aut per turn, P(banish) ~= 10%/turn
12:10:37 <elliptic> bh: that means average 10 turns to get banished, yes
12:11:00 <bh> erm right.
12:12:13 <kilobyte> bh: an issue not directly related to crawl: I'm told OSX ld complains about duplicate symbols. There's an initialized array in one .c file, and it's imported via a header elsewhere -- ie, your run of the mill symbol with exactly one non-undefined definition. Did you hear about this?
12:12:40 <bh> kilobyte: I did not.
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12:14:43 <ontoclasm> by the way, crawl gives me errors when building now (but still successfully builds)
12:15:05 <ontoclasm> is there something i should do about that?
12:15:47 <Cheibriados> 03bh 07* 0.12-a0-1757-gcbcea53: Self banish Spatial Maelstroms who escape the abyss 10(3 minutes ago, 2 files, 14+ 1-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=cbcea533cd44
12:16:25 <elliott> bh: what spatial maelstroms that escape the abyss? :p
12:17:14 <bh> elliott: corruption
12:17:27 <kilobyte> what with Zigs?
12:17:27 <elliott> well right now corruption never gives spatial maelstroms
12:17:38 <bh> elliott: it does now
12:17:40 <kilobyte> the player won't have a chance to walk close enough
12:17:50 <elliott> oh, you removed them from the list
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12:18:07 <bh> kilobyte: they might still spawn vortices
12:18:19 <bh> I didn't want to special case the zig monster list and the corruption list
12:19:17 <kilobyte> bh: are you on OS X currently?
12:19:26 <bh> kilobyte: yes. What would you like me to check?
12:19:56 <ontoclasm> hm, looks like boulder beetles still stop over deep water
12:20:01 <ontoclasm> and don't drown
12:20:27 <bh> ontoclasm: maybe they're pining for the fjords?
12:20:37 <ontoclasm> :D
12:20:41 <kilobyte> (if you have autoconf and friends) git@github.com:kilobyte/termrec.git, or pre-made http://angband.pl/tmp/termrec-0.16-13-g46b2d7f.tar.gz
12:21:52 <bh> kilobyte: it'll be a while
12:22:26 <kilobyte> someone got just "ld: 6 duplicate symbols for architecture x86_64", my hackintosh lasted long enough to show _charset_vt100 is involved but then started kernel panics (hackintosh hates AMD) so I have no real means to take a look
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12:23:02 <kilobyte> obviously, if it'd cost some of your actual time, then you probably don't care enough, but it might be something obvious
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12:24:44 <bh> kilobyte: I got the tarball, what do I do with it?
12:25:16 <kilobyte> ./configure && make
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12:27:19 <bh> kilobyte: https://gist.github.com/4580497
12:28:56 <bh> if you want something more exciting than that, I'd ask Neunon. I do most of my development in a vm
12:30:52 <Gretell> iroha (L13 DsFi) (Lair:3)
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12:34:57 <faze> %git :/ehum
12:34:58 <Cheibriados> 03MarvinPA * 0.12-a0-1755-gd67fa0f: Merge branch 'vehumet' 10(2 hours ago, files, + -) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=d67fa0f8d493
12:35:31 <kilobyte> some random page says OSX uses C++ rules of linkage for C, and adding "extern" explicitely helps. Could you prefix charset_vt100 and charset_cp437 with "extern" at the beginning of libtty/charsets.h ?
12:36:17 <faze> did someone write an actual commit message or documentation that explains new vehumet?
12:36:49 <elliott> haha, commit messages
12:36:52 <elliott> and documentation
12:37:02 <faze> oh right, this is crawl-dev, sorry
12:37:05 <kilobyte> bh: ^^^^^
12:37:13 <faze> kilobyte: i'm glad you agree with me
12:37:22 <faze> and you are telling bh to look at it too!
12:37:34 <faze> so what the heck changed for vehumet
12:37:39 <kilobyte> faze: I meant in using git syntax, ie, five lines above :p
12:37:40 <MarvinPA> the commits have commit messages
12:37:49 <elliptic> well I don't think it makes that much sense to document newveh in-game any more than any other god
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12:38:16 <MarvinPA> "Vehumet will offer followers the knowledge of increasingly powerful destructive spells as they gain piety."
12:38:16 <elliptic> the way it works is that veh periodically gives you the option of memorizing a spell
12:38:20 <MarvinPA> documentation successful
12:38:22 <elliott> bug report: vehamut the demon is still misspelled, mistitled in-game
12:38:40 <elliptic> and you currently have just 100 +d100 turns to memorize but that will likely change
12:38:49 <faze> ah ok
12:38:50 <kilobyte> faze: git log d67fa0f8^..d67fa0f8
12:39:04 <faze> that sounds alright i guess
12:39:16 <faze> still, a one time use 'magical scroll'
12:39:17 <elliptic> the spells gifted have a max level that depends on your piety, and a min level that depends on how many gifts you've been offered
12:39:37 <faze> that can only be used to memorize and not amnesia sounds better to me, but that's without trying newveh
12:39:46 <faze> elliptic: ah ok
12:39:56 <faze> i will wait to complain more until i try it
12:39:58 <elliptic> and you only get a finite number in total (15 iirc)
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12:40:35 <faze> well, it sounds like sif muna will be the new 'spell god'
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12:41:03 <elliott> how does that follow exactly
12:41:09 <faze> i guess i really only memorize a handful of spells that vehumet gifts anyways
12:41:17 <faze> so maybe it won't be much different at all
12:41:41 <elliptic> faze: if you were a conjurer and didn't care about summoning then newveh actually gifts more spells than oldveh
12:41:47 <elliptic> and starts gifting them much sooner
12:41:47 <faze> ah, gotcha
12:42:02 <faze> that actually sounds better
12:42:12 <faze> he lets you memorize 100% fail spells as well?
12:42:30 <elliptic> yes, at the moment you just need enough spell slots
12:43:00 <elliptic> note that I also removed the MP discount for L5+ spells from veh
12:43:04 <elliptic> since I was going to do that anyway
12:43:52 <faze> elliptic: i saw that
12:44:11 <faze> it was a bit ridiculous having mp on kills and reduced mp cost
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12:48:54 <bh> kilobyte: that worked
12:49:20 <kilobyte> bh: cool, great! Would you care to "make check" just to be sure?
12:49:37 <bh> 6: vt100 sequences FAILED (testsuite.at:29)
12:50:05 <kilobyte> bleh, care to send me tests/testsuite.log?
12:50:10 <bh> sure
12:52:25 <faze> kilobyte: ah, thanks for the git log thing
12:53:02 <faze> are the two hashes the merge commit and the first commit in the 'vehumet' branch?
12:53:21 <kilobyte> bh: thanks, I see what's wrong there as well. Mac's shell doesn't like \e as ESC.
12:53:23 <faze> oh, i see what it is.. nevermind
12:53:45 <bh> kilobyte: OSX is the most hostile development environment I've ever dealt with.
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12:55:21 <faze> kilobyte: you mean gnu-bash 3.2?
12:55:45 <kilobyte> ... and my hackintosh just worked long enough without a kernel panic to let me get there, looks like I wasted some of your time, sorry.
12:56:06 <kilobyte> nm says the symbol is C rather than U, unlike functions
12:56:56 <kilobyte> and unlike GNU ld, theirs doesn't allow linking C with D (defined)
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13:10:32 <Henzell> josh the Slicer (L7 SpBe) ASSERT(!at_branch_bottom()) in 'stairs.cc' at line 533 failed on turn 639. (Abyss)
13:10:44 <bh> :-\
13:11:04 <Henzell> josh the Slicer (L7 SpBe) ASSERT(!at_branch_bottom()) in 'stairs.cc' at line 533 failed on turn 566. (Abyss)
13:11:14 <greensnark> !lm josh crash x=v
13:11:15 <Sequell> No milestones for josh (crash).
13:11:23 <Cheibriados> Game don't start (maybe because of cyrillic letters is username?) (https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=6552) by sidav
13:11:27 <greensnark> !lm josh crash x=v
13:11:28 <Sequell> No milestones for josh (crash).
13:11:31 <MarvinPA> is that the sprint one again?
13:11:33 <elliptic> it is sprint abyss
13:11:35 <elliptic> yes
13:11:38 <bh> seen any good abyss deaths lately?
13:11:42 <greensnark> Oh
13:12:14 <kilobyte> so, disable abyss in the sprint, (y/y)?
13:12:15 <Henzell> josh the Slicer (L7 SpBe) ASSERT(!at_branch_bottom()) in 'stairs.cc' at line 533 failed on turn 680. (Abyss)
13:12:39 <elliptic> kilobyte: and lugonu too?
13:12:39 <BlastHardcheese> only if you add abysssprint
13:13:15 <kilobyte> elliptic: banishment and distortion weapons could work
13:13:45 <elliptic> I guess... do abyssal knights in sprint already start out of the abyss?
13:15:09 <bh> elliptic: they probably shouldn't
13:16:28 <elliott> they start in abyss
13:16:39 <elliott> it's kind of a depressing abyss though
13:17:01 <kilobyte> faze: turns out I used \d027 in sed. Is there any way to get ESC in sed on OS X? Or can I rely on perl being present?
13:17:22 <greensnark> You can rely on perl being present
13:17:30 <kilobyte> greensnark: cool, thanks!
13:17:30 <greensnark> It's part of the base OSX install
13:20:13 <faze> kilobyte: 5.12.4, to be specific (on mountain lion)
13:21:34 <Grunt> bh, per my earlier silly idea: http://pastebin.com/34DmzyRr
13:22:47 <bh> Grunt: I'd genericize the cloud code a bit more, but it's a matter of taste
13:23:00 <bh> I think you're going to get objections on the basis that it's silly or something
13:23:40 <bh> shouldn't it be perma-confused?
13:24:36 <elliptic> <3 chaos butterfly
13:25:46 <bh> would anyone object to me boosting the frequency of apocalypse crabs to the 'new abyssals' section?
13:25:51 <MarvinPA> probably having them as common as the other new abyssals is not so great, that would mean a whole lot of chaos clouds all over the place
13:26:00 <MarvinPA> oh that was meant to be about chaos butterflies
13:26:03 <bh> MarvinPA: killed two birds with one stone ;)
13:26:05 <MarvinPA> but also applies to apocalypse crabs
13:26:07 <MarvinPA> :P
13:26:13 * bh high-fives MPA
13:26:44 <bh> ok -- how about as common as Spatial Maelstroms?
13:27:11 <kilobyte> no causing tornadoes in far away parts of the level? :p
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13:27:49 <Grunt> bh: I want it to be actively malicious :)
13:28:02 <Grunt> Otherwise they'll just get lost in the abyss and you'll never see them.
13:28:10 <bh> ??hell knight
13:28:10 <Henzell> hell knight[1/1]: Often signifies the presence of Margery. Tends to be outrageously well equipped (often has a demon weapon). When it's not hitting you with a ridiculous weapon, is either casting a) pain and haste, or b) bolt of fire and (in emergencies) blink.
13:28:13 <bh> ??hell sentinel
13:28:14 <Henzell> hell sentinel[1/2]: A rank 1 demon. Lots of AC, omniresistant, speed 10 to pit fiend's speed 8, spiny, casts hellfire and iron shot (but not torment).
13:28:46 <elliptic> kilobyte: that does seem more fitting
13:28:54 <elliptic> chaos clouds are sort of boring
13:29:04 <elliptic> "chaos butterfly" deserves better!
13:29:27 <bh> chaos butterfly could screw with the rng ;)
13:29:28 <MarvinPA> and yeah there are already apocalypse crabs for chaos cloudiness, some other effect would be neat
13:30:09 <greensnark> I assumed a chaos butterfly would produce hurricanes
13:30:22 <greensnark> Or twisters
13:30:33 <ChrisOelmueller> can that butterfly *please* get the mesmerize message back
13:30:38 <ChrisOelmueller> i'll pay good money
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13:30:45 <bh> ChrisOelmueller: hm?
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13:31:18 <ChrisOelmueller> it was some syraine thing
13:31:26 <ChrisOelmueller> -VISUAL SPELL:The butterfly flaps @possessive@ wings in an oddly mesmeric pattern.
13:31:35 <ChrisOelmueller> ruined by MarvinPA
13:31:43 <ChrisOelmueller> %git b64770d53168
13:31:44 <Cheibriados> 03MarvinPA * 0.10-a0-934-gb64770d: Remove a misleading speech line 10(1 year, 4 months ago, 1 file, 0+ 7-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=b64770d53168
13:32:07 <kilobyte> for movement, what about brownian motion biased towards going in your direction? With their speed, it'd be enough to follow you, and bat movement would look bad on them.
13:32:21 <bh> ??vortex
13:32:21 <Henzell> I don't have a page labeled vortex in my learndb.
13:32:25 <kilobyte> s/ruined/fortunately gone, mighty thanks to/
13:32:33 <kilobyte> er, ChrisOelmueller:
13:33:27 <ChrisOelmueller> nobody was seeing its true potential
13:33:31 <ChrisOelmueller> the saddest thing :-(
13:34:05 <kilobyte> fruit salad spam that makes you want to rip your eyes out, standing out over any actual messages
13:34:19 <bh> FR: A multi-square plant monster for lair that sends out runners and attempts to surround you with its mass.
13:34:48 <bh> Grunt: you could give the butterfly rain clouds
13:35:08 <Grunt> Heh.
13:35:15 <Grunt> Really, I wanted to give it tornado, but...
13:35:25 <kilobyte> I wish English had a word like Polish "oczojebny", as that fits them best
13:36:13 <bh> kilobyte: just use it enough and it will become a loan word
13:36:29 <kilobyte> bh: kudzu?
13:36:44 <bh> kilobyte: yeah!
13:36:55 <bh> it could use the tentacles code
13:37:19 <bh> (Is three tentacle monsters too many?)
13:37:55 <kilobyte> bh: in slavic languages the f-word is far more productive than in English (where it's quite impressive already)
13:38:00 <ChrisOelmueller> cannot parse <bh> tentacle monsters too many
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13:38:47 <kilobyte> ChrisOelmueller: ask a japanese schoolgirl?
13:38:59 <bh> kilobyte: or rather, the Fisherman's Wife.
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13:46:11 * Grunt makes some adjustments...
13:51:08 <blackcustard> bh: genetrix versa from ivan?
13:51:52 <blackcustard> they aren't tentacles though, they are melee statues basically, and they spawn all over the level
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14:40:07 <bh> blackcustard: what?
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14:45:29 <blackcustard> multi tile boss monster early on in the game; it's an immobile killer plant that summons smaller immobile killer plants all over the level
14:45:47 <bh> blackcustard: ah. Never heard of the game
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14:49:35 <blackcustard> (iter vehemens ad necem)
14:50:33 <blackcustard> vesana* (sorry) http://www.attnam.com/wiki/Genetrix_Vesana
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15:19:50 <bh> While we're talking about corruption: Should it produce monsters that only happen to be in the abyss, like Angels?
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15:27:42 <Cheibriados> 03bh 07* 0.12-a0-1758-g0ca470a: Abyss Monster Probabilities 10(5 minutes ago, 1 file, 2+ 2-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=0ca470a3b3f3
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15:31:01 <ontoclasm> bh: https://dl.dropbox.com/u/1000017/crawl/starspawn.7z
15:31:04 <ontoclasm> happy birthday
15:31:06 <Grunt> bh: http://pastebin.com/GM7NzLc2
15:31:13 <Grunt> ...happy birthday x2!)
15:31:16 <Grunt> s/)//
15:31:36 <bh> ontoclasm: 7z...
15:31:38 <Grunt> I had a really terrible vault idea when I was out earlier.
15:31:41 <ontoclasm> oh
15:31:43 <bh> do I even have a decompressor for that?
15:31:44 <Grunt> ...I should do that next :b
15:31:45 <ontoclasm> fine, hold on:/
15:31:53 <Grunt> bh: p7zip?
15:32:05 <bh> Grunt: yeesh -- SPELL_SUMMON_TWISTER
15:32:22 <bh> ontoclasm: is it tiles? :)
15:32:57 <ontoclasm> https://dl.dropbox.com/u/1000017/crawl/starspawn.zip
15:33:00 <ontoclasm> there, zip
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15:33:47 <bh> whoa.
15:34:27 <Grunt> bh: that's the fun part!!!
15:34:29 <ontoclasm> i couldn't understand the tentacle drawing code immediately so i leave it to you xD
15:34:44 <bh> ontoclasm: Draco understands that code.
15:34:51 <ontoclasm> awesome
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15:36:02 <ontoclasm> now to make a d:8 vault with a starspawn in it
15:36:20 * Grunt gestures at ontoclasm. ontoclasm is devoured by a tear in reality.
15:36:38 <ontoclasm> jokes on you, i'm an AK irl
15:37:40 <HangedMan> if there's no further kerfuffle about using them outside of abyss I wanted to make teleporters.des more exciting by having abyss-like pockets with abyss monsters in them
15:38:00 <HangedMan> sadly even as such it will probably not place a starspawn on d:8
15:38:13 <Cheibriados> tentacled starspawn (11X) | Spd: 8 | HD: 16 | HP: 68-108 | AC/EV: 5/5 | Dam: 45, 35 | 05demonic, 10doors, see invisible, !sil | Res: 06magic(128), 09poison+++, 12drown, 04rot, 13neg+++, 13torm | Vul: 08holy++ | XP: 2115 | Sp: spawn tentacles | Sz: Giant | Int: normal.
15:38:13 <ontoclasm> %??tentacled starspawn
15:38:23 <ontoclasm> oh, they're not that bad
15:38:30 <ontoclasm> only two stone giants stapled together
15:38:42 <HangedMan> two stone giants that pull you in
15:38:54 <HangedMan> they're very easy to walk away from though, dracoomega needs to make them speed 10
15:39:10 <ontoclasm> how fast are the tentacles?
15:39:16 <Cheibriados> starspawn tentacle (11w) | Spd: 10 | HD: 18 | HP: 12-26 | AC/EV: 8/2 | Dam: 203(constrict) | 05demonic, lev | Res: 13magic(immune), 09poison+++, 04rot, 13neg+++, 13torm | Vul: 08holy++ | XP: 0 | Sz: Large | Int: normal.
15:39:16 <ontoclasm> %??starspawn tentacle
15:39:21 <bh> Grunt: if you want to commit that I have no objection. If you want, run it by someone who actually understands the game ;)
15:39:32 <Grunt> I'd at least need a tile first. :b
15:39:38 <ontoclasm> i would just make the tentacles lke speed 30
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15:39:49 <Grunt> I'm not *that* eager to get it into the game; I'd rather other people see it first :)
15:39:58 <HangedMan> it's something like hasted human, but the problem is the constriction is supposed to do no damage but has no difficulty in getting away too
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15:40:42 <HangedMan> apparently tentacle code cannot be understood even by somebody fixing them
15:42:23 <bh> Grunt: first the monster then the tile!
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15:49:13 <Henzell> severin the Skirmisher (L8 DsCK) ASSERT(_valid()) in 'ray.cc' at line 194 failed on turn 6601. (D:6)
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15:51:53 <Grunt> ...here's the basic layout for the aforementioned terrible vault idea:
15:51:56 <Grunt> http://pastebin.com/X6qVm38c
15:52:12 * Grunt ponders how many people will understand :b
15:52:44 <HangedMan> extremely subtle with the naming there
15:53:00 <Grunt> If you recognise the name, you probably understand the rest of it, heh.
15:53:17 <HangedMan> there are not many depths where two hell knights are really boss like yet ten hell beasts won't be scarier
15:53:36 <HangedMan> ten... invisible... hell beasts...
15:53:47 <Gretell> Fleurka (L15 HOFE) (Shoals:2)
15:53:48 <DracoOmega> ontoclasm: I'm afraid that I never actually looked much at the tentacle drawing code myself
15:53:57 <Grunt> I don't seriously intend for this design to go anywhere; I just thought it was funny.
15:54:19 <DracoOmega> Also, I believe the tentacles are like speed 16 or 18 (despite what the monster data tells you, because tentacles are odd)
15:54:31 <Napkin> hmm, crash on kraken kill?
15:54:44 <Grunt> !lm fleurka crash -log
15:54:45 <Sequell> 1. Fleurka, XL15 HOFE, T:48149 (milestone): http://crawl.develz.org/morgues/0.11/Fleurka/crash-Fleurka-20130120-215344.txt
15:54:56 <DracoOmega> But yes, the starspawn probably do need some adjustments
15:55:16 <DracoOmega> (And I should look into whether constriction damage really DOES affect escape chance, since I thought that was only HD)
15:55:26 <Grunt> Napkin, a vault-specific thing, it looks like...
15:55:44 <Napkin> oh, aha
15:56:11 <Napkin> didn't see a vault anywhere close to her
15:56:43 <Grunt> !vault shoals_atoll
15:56:47 <Henzell> Lines pasted to http://pastie.org/5739869
15:56:54 <Napkin> ---
15:56:57 <Napkin> You kill the kraken!
15:56:57 <Napkin> Vehumet accepts your kill.
15:56:57 <Napkin> You feel your power returning.
15:56:59 <Napkin> The tentacle dies!
15:57:02 <Napkin> Writing crash info to /crawl-0.11/morgue/Fleurka/crash-Fleurka-20130120-215344.txt
15:57:05 <Napkin> ---
15:57:15 <HangedMan> grunt: it's already better the the average volcano
15:57:17 <Napkin> isn't it rather a chicken-egg problem?
15:57:21 <Grunt> HangedMan, heh.
15:57:29 <DracoOmega> Well, if it's 0.11, possibly it's already been fixed?
15:57:35 * Grunt turns it into a volcano vault <_<
15:57:46 <Grunt> I'd have to do up the rest of the level to make that work :b
15:57:49 <DracoOmega> Since various tentacle bugs were
15:58:15 <HangedMan> just make the rest of it the corresponding doomrl map
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16:00:21 <ZenArcade> is monster wand use limited by hd or something - edmund could've one shotted my mummy with his wand of fireball but he never used it
16:00:37 <HangedMan> no monsters use fireball wands
16:01:02 <ZenArcade> that's good too
16:01:02 <greensnark> Grunt: fix that pls
16:01:14 <greensnark> (monsters not using fireball wands)
16:01:23 <DracoOmega> Y'know... I had never noticed that they didn't
16:01:26 <DracoOmega> Somehow
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16:01:31 <greensnark> Grunt: I hear you're the Grunt who wrote GruntHack, is this correct?
16:01:32 <DracoOmega> But now that you mention it....
16:01:54 <elliptic> greensnark: monsters not using fireball wands is sort of nice I think given how ridiculously overpowered monster fireball is
16:02:00 <elliptic> like, it does more damage than bolt of fire
16:02:13 <greensnark> That needn't be the case for the wand, however
16:02:19 <elliptic> right, it could be changed
16:02:45 <greensnark> Monster fireball damage is still not fixed?!
16:02:54 <elliott> I like monster fireball damage
16:03:02 <greensnark> It's been a case of "We should fix this!" since 0.1
16:03:11 <elliott> can we just make every monster spell op instead
16:04:10 <Cheibriados> 03dolorous 07* 0.12-a0-1759-g33f1df7: Add formatting fixes. 10(in the future, 1 file, 3+ 3-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=33f1df76fede
16:04:12 <Cheibriados> Crash when tentacle died after kraken (https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=6553) by Napkin
16:04:12 <Napkin> hehe, hi greensnarking :)
16:04:12 <DracoOmega> Monster fireball damage doesn't seem unproblematic to me
16:04:12 <greensnark> Napking!
16:04:12 <DracoOmega> But the wands should probably not be quite so effective
16:04:12 <DracoOmega> doesn't seem problematic*
16:04:45 <HangedMan> monster fireball damage doesn't seem problematic because orbs of fire and margery would deal lots of damage anyway while one spell on wizards/deep elf mages/ogre mages is barely noticable
16:05:06 <DracoOmega> Napkin: I think that is already fixed in trunk?
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16:06:33 <Napkin> and too complicated to port to 0.11?
16:06:40 <Napkin> let's see
16:07:10 <DracoOmega> Well, there were a whole pile of tentacle changes bundled together
16:07:24 <DracoOmega> But several were a bit entangled with the addition of starspawn, too
16:07:53 <DracoOmega> So I'm not sure if the relevant commits here can be cherry-picked without editing
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16:09:14 <Cheibriados> 03dolorous 07* 0.12-a0-1760-g14c2b7b: Also mark eldritch tentacle segments as abyssal-only. 10(in the future, 1 file, 1+ 0-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=14c2b7ba590e
16:09:22 <Napkin> well, it's a crash bug.. should be fixed somehow
16:09:43 <HangedMan> who would possibly think of using individual eldritch tentacle segments for anything
16:09:49 <HangedMan> (cough, cough)
16:09:52 <elliott> nobody knows why they're even in that function at all
16:09:55 <elliott> eldritch tentacles in general that is
16:09:57 <DracoOmega> Well, it's possible this fix was not so entangled? I honestly don't remember for certain what I did - it's been a while
16:10:21 <DracoOmega> But I'm pretty sure a tentacle head should clean up and kill all its child segments automatically when it dies
16:10:29 <alefury> elliott: kilobyte said he added them because the function doubled as "is eldritch monster"
16:10:31 <HangedMan> elliott: they're in there because incomrepehsnbiel laziness, duh
16:10:31 <DracoOmega> With no additional messages and such
16:10:43 <HangedMan> that is a fantastic typo
16:10:47 <alefury> so someone should probably take them out of that list
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16:10:56 <elliott> alefury: are you sure that was kilobyte? I guessed that that was what it was exactly :P
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16:11:11 <alefury> elliott: he said so earlier today
16:11:15 <elliott> fair enough
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16:11:54 <elliott> though I don't see it in today's log
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16:12:20 <alefury> [18:48:37] <kilobyte> and yeah, I've put eldritch tentacles there not because corruption can pull them in (it can't), but because of the function being faux MH_ELDRITCH
16:12:28 <alefury> youll have to adjust that timestamp
16:12:35 <elliott> oh, there it is
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16:12:41 <elliott> heh, it was even right after I said it
16:12:47 <elliott> need to pay more attention
16:13:27 <HangedMan> a faux mh_eldritch that wasn't used for anything else
16:13:56 <alefury> cant blame him for thinking ahead
16:14:35 <alefury> i mean you could, because he did, but thats not a bad thing
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16:28:31 <blackcustard> is alstair's worth picking up if i'm training poison magic anyway?
16:28:35 <blackcustard> alistair's*
16:28:48 <HangedMan> wrong channel
16:28:51 <blackcustard> opps
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16:34:30 <Cheibriados> 03dolorous 07* 0.12-a0-1761-g8d846c9: Unify mons_is_native_in_branch() for the Abyss and mons_is_abyssal_only(). 10(in the future, 1 file, 8+ 14-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=8d846c9821e0
16:34:57 <elliott> erm...
16:35:02 <elliott> doesn't that re-expand the list?
16:35:30 <elliott> oh, never mind
16:36:10 <HangedMan> it does mean zymes and maelstroms around >s potentially though
16:36:16 <HangedMan> so hooray more maelstroms
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16:39:35 <Cheibriados> 03ontoclasm 07* 0.12-a0-1762-g42e2b60: Abyssal stair and exit tiles 10(25 seconds ago, 8 files, 3+ 1-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=42e2b609698e
16:40:14 <HangedMan> wonderful, that actually looks like a stair
16:40:20 <ontoclasm> hah
16:40:39 <elliott> imo make them >s too
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16:42:37 <ontoclasm> this is what i was thinking it looked like as you're taking it:
16:42:38 <ontoclasm> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sLq_IlYoSdk&feature=player_detailpage#t=69s
16:43:37 <HangedMan> but can you fall down these stairs
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16:54:45 <Cheibriados> 03bh 07* 0.12-a0-1763-gad811aa: Corruption: Retry on ineligible monsters 10(11 minutes ago, 1 file, 14+ 10-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=ad811aa0a379
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17:04:51 <Cheibriados> 03dolorous 07* 0.12-a0-1764-g02f5316: Add formatting fixes. 10(in the future, 1 file, 2+ 0-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=02f53164f5cb
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17:24:18 <bh> Is dol a real person a lint bot?
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17:30:29 <elliott> time-travelling lint bot from the future
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17:39:36 <alefury> ontoclasm: awesome abyss portal
17:40:12 <HangedMan> hmm, what tiles are left
17:40:44 <HangedMan> maelstrom's done, tentacled starspawn tentacles are done, disjunction's done, uh
17:41:03 <DracoOmega> Well, the tentacles are drawn, I think, but not coded?
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17:41:22 <DracoOmega> I think the code for them may actually be somewhat tricky, too?
17:41:30 <HangedMan> oh boy
17:42:03 <DracoOmega> It's probably not too terrible, since it mostly needs to replicate what kraken already do, but it's not as easy an insert as most things
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17:59:00 <bh> has anyone encountered the wastes yet?
18:02:07 <HangedMan> bh: please commit my 10 abyss vaults and I will investigate
18:02:14 <bh> HangedMan: link?
18:02:28 <HangedMan> https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=6527
18:03:08 <bh> can I just blindly apply these? historically your vaults have been quite good.
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18:03:27 <MarvinPA> at least look at them just in case :P
18:03:32 <HangedMan> one of the vaults is meant to replace another vault
18:03:48 <alefury> if its gotten that far it might be good to just make him a dev :P
18:03:57 <elliott> bh: how closely did you look at HangedMan's vaults in the past :P
18:04:23 <HangedMan> of the ones submitted I guess the questionable ones would be: restless_catacombs, steaming_rock, six_sided_sadism
18:04:42 <elliott> I like how you have a ready-made list of the bad ones
18:04:49 <HangedMan> no I just made that
18:04:50 <elliott> that's efficiency
18:06:02 <HangedMan> I mean, a cloud generator under glass that becomes larger when you dig it out is kind of very gimmicky and weird but it's abyss so it's hardly out of place
18:06:46 <HangedMan> the tar vault is possibly too malnevolent but tar is the weakest hell anyway
18:07:02 <HangedMan> what do we have to do to bring evilmike back
18:07:21 <bh> HangedMan: I think you're better off with someone competent committing these
18:07:30 <HangedMan> welp
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18:09:06 <elliott> yes assign me
18:10:10 <HangedMan> elliott: can you read vaults yet
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18:11:26 <elliott> nope
18:11:41 <HangedMan> so what precisely will you contribute
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18:12:08 <elliott> um I'm good at making fun of you? quite competent with git, can remember where vaults are stored on a good day
18:12:21 <elliott> I view my main contribution to the HangedMan vault committing process as making fun though
18:12:31 <elliott> everyone has their own place in the synergy
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18:13:17 <HangedMan> speaking of which
18:13:52 <HangedMan> zaba: so just get rid of mini_float on the fully-bordered-by-floor vaults? nothing else that doesn't need mini_float?
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19:07:50 <greensnark> HangedMan: Abyss:2- on hangedman_classic_abyss_death will be ignored since abyss dungeon gen doesn't check depth for maps tagged abyss
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19:08:07 <HangedMan> would just the depth work then?
19:08:18 <greensnark> I think the 'abyss' tag no longer makes sense
19:08:27 <HangedMan> wonderful
19:08:27 <greensnark> Since Abyss is a first class branch and can be used in DEPTH:
19:08:46 <greensnark> abyss_rune and _exit tags still make sense
19:08:51 <HangedMan> another thing to patch I'll run by your and zaba first
19:12:03 <greensnark> Also hangedman_illusive_loot uses "any item" which should be "any", no?
19:14:57 <HangedMan> whoops
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19:41:27 <Cheibriados> 03Grunt 07* 0.12-a0-1765-gb4b189b: Prune duplicate code for LOS attack spells. 10(5 minutes ago, 11 files, 416+ 345-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=b4b189bfd064
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19:41:47 <Grunt> I love how that ended up adding more lines than it removed. >_<
19:42:11 <Grunt> Side effect: monster OTR!
19:42:20 <Grunt> So now I can go and edit Lamia's spell set <_<
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19:42:33 <HangedMan> do we get to have monsters casting ignite poison yet
19:43:04 <greensnark> Grunt: Are you the GruntHack author
19:43:05 <HangedMan> would clearly be a good swamp monster
19:43:08 <Grunt> greensnark: I am.
19:43:09 <HangedMan> yes he is
19:43:10 <greensnark> Inquiring minds want to know
19:43:13 <greensnark> Aha!
19:43:14 <greensnark> <3
19:43:14 <Lightli> Lamia?
19:43:23 <Grunt> Lamia is a Snake unique I am working on.
19:43:27 <Lightli> ok
19:43:37 <HangedMan> it's a rather straightforward choice of name
19:43:57 <Grunt> HangedMan: that could be a response to either of the lines of dialogue <_<
19:44:08 <Grunt> If you mean Lamia, it was ontoclasm's suggestion; I took it and ran with it.
19:44:17 <HangedMan> fair enough
19:44:45 <DracoOmega> I again say that she should not be poisoned-themed, as everything else down there already is and it would be hard to distinguish her interestingly from greater naga and such
19:45:35 <Grunt> I would at least like her to have OTR as a poison spell <_<
19:45:59 <DracoOmega> I also still say that she should mesmerize :P
19:46:08 <Grunt> I was thinking about swapping parrow for IOOD, confuse for mesmerise, pcloud for something else (maybe OTR)...
19:46:25 <HangedMan> how did I keep delaying an abyss vault mashing all the lair branches together
19:46:32 <DracoOmega> IOOD + msermerize sounds kind of brutal
19:46:39 <Grunt> DracoOmega: good >:)
19:46:40 <HangedMan> it is clearly the end result of new stuff
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19:47:03 <Grunt> I wonder if I could get away with using Dig. <_<
19:47:15 <elliott> only if you give it to cacodemons too
19:47:27 <HangedMan> also deep troll earth mages
19:47:32 <DracoOmega> Also deep troll earth elementalist!
19:47:34 <DracoOmega> Yeah, that
19:47:35 <Grunt> I do want to do deep troll bands at some point.
19:47:54 <Grunt> (The deep troll wields a guitar! The deep troll plays an awesome tune. You are mesmerised by the deep troll!)
19:48:18 <greensnark> *wields a blade of distortion
19:48:32 <HangedMan> axe of distortion
19:48:41 <greensnark> Thanks
19:48:47 <Grunt> Space bends crazily around the speakers!
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19:51:48 <Grunt> Ooh. Evil idea for the empty spell slot: Miasma!
19:51:58 <HangedMan> ........
19:52:12 <HangedMan> maybe if it's emergency slot, eurgh
19:52:36 <DracoOmega> No miasma please
19:52:47 <Grunt> ...you're ruining my fun :b
19:53:40 <HangedMan> if you want to be nasty then design more extended stuff, regular games encountering miasma monsters any more often then the near never except all the way down in zot is frustrating
19:54:20 <DracoOmega> To say nothing of flavor compatibility in this case
19:54:26 <monqy> undead swamp
19:54:35 <HangedMan> near never
19:54:48 <DracoOmega> Besides, who there ENJOYS the miasma?
19:55:02 <Grunt> The designers!!!
19:55:03 * Grunt flees.
19:55:14 <HangedMan> <somepeg> damn players
19:56:00 <HangedMan> it mirrors the freezing and flaming cloud stuff (not that the steam from fire is much better), but I'd rather have like three death drakes in the starting corridor accompanied by one or two swamp drakes instead of miasma generators
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19:56:17 <HangedMan> miasma generators barely work in tar vault testing
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20:09:37 <Grunt> I'll leave the last spell slot open for the moment...
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20:10:04 <Grunt> http://pastebin.com/eqZ9mYjD
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20:14:24 <HangedMan> suddenly realized huge damage that likes close-range and mesmerize is pretty close to the (never used anyway) gimmick of jory
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20:15:19 <Grunt> Jory who?
20:15:20 <Grunt> <___________<
20:15:27 <Grunt> (...yes I know who Jory is.)
20:15:53 <Lightli> HangedMan: You mean the unique vampire who tends to spawn in a vault filled with silent spectres and thus is a joke anyways?
20:16:10 <Grunt> !lm . uniq=jory
20:16:12 <HangedMan> yes, that is what I mean by "never used anyway gimmick"
20:16:13 <Sequell> No milestones for Grunt (uniq=jory).
20:16:16 <elliott> yeah jory's new spellset is really good at that
20:16:17 <Grunt> ...huh.
20:16:19 <elliott> if you spawn him out of silence
20:16:26 <elliott> I really liked it when I tuned it in wizmode
20:16:37 <elliott> someone should make actually good jory vaults or fix the existing ones so he can actually cast them
20:16:39 <Grunt> 1fight Jory v Lamia
20:16:42 * Grunt goes to try this.
20:16:53 <HangedMan> I'm still working on a few draining-themed vaults for tar
20:17:04 <HangedMan> that could place him
20:17:05 <elliott> that said I made all vampires into ilsuiw clones according to HangedMan
20:17:11 <elliott> so I guess my spellset is due for usurping anyway
20:17:19 <elliott> btw jory is still going to be kind of pathetic in tar
20:17:31 <HangedMan> accompanied by profane servitors and loros?
20:18:39 <Grunt> I love Jory splattering everywhere on death.
20:18:43 <Grunt> 7-3 Lamia, for the record.
20:21:08 <Grunt> 6-4 against Arachne, 7-3 in a battle of the bands against Ilsuiw.
20:21:48 <HangedMan> cheating without some kind of arena that makes there be adequate but not too much water
20:22:02 <Grunt> I'll try again with a watery arena...
20:22:10 <Grunt> 5-5 with the band against the Lernaean hydra.
20:23:57 <Grunt> 6-4 bandfight against Ilsuiw in arena:swamp.
20:25:45 <Grunt> 0-10 against Tiamat band :b
20:26:43 <HangedMan> ??branch ends
20:26:43 <Henzell> branch ends[1/1]: Latest trunk: Blade:1, Coc:7, Crypt:5, D:27, Dis:7, Elf:3, Geh:7, Hell:1, Lair:8, Orc:4, Shoals:5, Slime:6, Snake:5, Swamp:5, Tar:7, Temple:1, Tomb:3, Vaults:5, Zot:5
20:26:47 <Grunt> 8-2 against Saint Roka band...
20:27:26 <HangedMan> blade, elf, lair (somewhat), vaults
20:27:55 <Grunt> todo: buff Fannar, place him in Elf:$ <_<
20:28:27 <HangedMan> elves are fond of being refridgerated to death yes
20:28:42 <Grunt> Blade is gimmicky enough as it is, and already has a "boss" of sorts (there's a guaranteed high quality weapon at the end, IIRC).
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20:30:39 <Cheibriados> Elvenking (02e) | Spd: 15 | HD: 20 | HP: 113-146 | AC/EV: 0/25 | Dam: 25, 25 | 10weapons, 10items, 10doors | Res: 06magic(160) | Chunks: 07contam | XP: 7081 | Sp: crystal spear (3d40), destruction orb (8d17), fire storm (8d15), ice storm (10d13), greater demon, teleport self | Sz: Medium | Int: high.
20:30:39 <Grunt> %??deep elf blademaster name:Elvenking n_rpl n_des col:disco hd:20 spells:lehudib's_crystal_spear;orb_of_destruction;fire_storm;ice_storm;summon_greater_demon;teleport_self actual_spells
20:30:41 <HangedMan> but terpischore
20:30:43 <Grunt> <_<
20:31:15 <Grunt> ...needs more spell variety.
20:31:48 <HangedMan> (I'd like to convert blade to a small serial vault or make it much smaller of a level and make it place "themes" of weapons but it probably could just go away instead)
20:32:06 <Lightli> http://pastebin.com/Pg3w9Hd6
20:32:11 <Lightli> HangedMan, complain away
20:32:19 <DracoOmega> Personally, I like the concept of Blade and wish it was more relevant
20:33:10 <HangedMan> why are there regular trees in swamp
20:33:32 <Lightli> How do I put down the other type of tree then?
20:33:32 <Grunt> Variety?
20:33:40 <Grunt> Lightli, KFEAT: <tile> = mangrove
20:33:45 <Grunt> s/tile/glyph/
20:33:51 <Lightli> Thanks
20:33:54 <HangedMan> admittedly then the vault doesn't really _work_
20:34:06 <elliott> DracoOmega: blade is now relevant because it's a room in vaults!
20:34:09 <HangedMan> heh
20:34:09 <Grunt> Put a hydra or two in there.
20:34:11 <Grunt> :b
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20:34:33 <Grunt> !lm . branch.enter=blade
20:34:34 <Sequell> Unknown field: branch.enter
20:34:35 <Grunt> er
20:34:38 <Grunt> !lm . br.enter=blade
20:34:42 <HangedMan> also use actual KPROP: *w = no_rtele_into instead of tagging it
20:34:52 <Sequell> 2. [2012-08-10 22:22:47] SGrunt the Axe Maniac (L23 DDBe) entered the Hall of Blades on turn 63835. (Vaults:4)
20:34:54 <HangedMan> can mix both tree types I guess though since other vaults do
20:37:12 <Lightli> http://pastebin.com/Pg3w9Hd6
20:37:15 <Lightli> Is this better?
20:37:29 <Grunt> Lightli: wrong link :b
20:37:35 <Grunt> Lightli: that's the same link you gave earlier.
20:37:49 <Lightli> I got an account to edit them directly now
20:37:57 <Lightli> No more reuploading for me
20:38:00 <Grunt> o_O
20:38:05 <Lightli> :D
20:38:14 <HangedMan> could have just used something better like pastie
20:38:23 <Grunt> I'd probably add something like "SUBST: T = Tt" before the KFEAT line.
20:38:27 <Grunt> ...so that you get a mix of trees.
20:38:46 <Lightli> Sure.
20:38:59 <HangedMan> noooooooooo
20:39:08 <Lightli> Ok, holding
20:39:12 <Lightli> What's wrong
20:39:21 <HangedMan> randomization goes _after_ glyph definition and before tile definition
20:39:28 <HangedMan> well
20:40:11 <HangedMan> ideally it's name, tags, depth, orient, weight, glyph definition, randomization, tile definition, lua, but I'll just go nuts expecting any sort of standards with vault syntax
20:41:36 <Lightli> Done
20:41:49 <Lightli> And I put the randomization after the glyph definition
20:42:50 <Lightli> Anything else, or am I good?
20:43:04 <HangedMan> minimal but acceptable, I guess
20:43:30 <Lightli> yay
20:43:31 <HangedMan> by the way, can we lift the minivault dummy being huge for swamp, there are branches with less minivaults now
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20:44:49 <Lightli> ??zin
20:44:49 <Henzell> zin[1/7]: Zin gives mutation resistance (growing to immunity at maximum piety), feeding if you pray when starving, {recite} (enchantment-type effects on humanoids), {vitalization} ('healing' of all sorts / stat boosts), {imprison} (tomb other), {sanctuary} (creates a temporary attack-free zone), and ("sometimes watches over you") life saving.
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20:51:48 <ontoclasm> this comment mystifies me
20:51:58 <ontoclasm> // Xom, Vehumet = 90
20:52:05 <ontoclasm> this is in the list of ability tiles
20:52:10 <Cheibriados> 03elliptic 07* 0.12-a0-1766-g3ef2337: Switch Vehumet-gifted spells to use the memorization interface (elliott). 10(6 minutes ago, 9 files, 43+ 67-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=3ef23371e336
20:53:17 <ontoclasm> ...oh
20:53:32 <elliott> well I hear vehumet is taking a page from xom's book
20:53:37 <Grunt> Haha.
20:53:40 <ontoclasm> well, i guess i don't need to implement a tile for it
20:54:46 <Grunt> ontoclasm: apparently I wrote that comment <_<
20:55:15 <ontoclasm> i get that X and V have no abilities but
20:55:18 <ontoclasm> why 90
20:55:27 <Grunt> I have absolutely no idea.
20:55:35 <Grunt> My best guess is that it has something to do with tile numbering.
20:56:40 <ontoclasm> hm
20:57:33 <Grunt> So ontoclasm, I have a couple of more-or-less finished unique designs that could use tiles, and possibly also a regular monster design. <_<
20:57:57 <ontoclasm> hah
20:58:24 <Grunt> (ontoclasm escaped (hah) into ##crawl-dev!)
20:59:29 <MarvinPA> ontoclasm: that's where the enums for those god abilities are
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20:59:59 <MarvinPA> each god has a block of 10, except until earlier xom and vehumet had no abilities (and now they don't again!)
21:00:08 <ontoclasm> i see
21:00:26 <Grunt> Aha.
21:00:41 <MarvinPA> see divine abilities in enum.h, i guess it's just to make it easier to add new god abilities while maintaining save compat
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21:01:32 <elliott> when did xom have an ability
21:01:46 <elliott> oh hah did I remove vehumet's ability right as ontoclasm went to make a tile for it
21:01:49 <MarvinPA> never
21:02:08 <ontoclasm> yes, i was like 10 seconds from commiting it
21:02:29 <elliott> ontoclasm: would you like a new vehumet spell memorisation-related tiles job?????
21:02:35 <ontoclasm> !!
21:02:49 <ontoclasm> what's that?
21:03:10 <elliott> ontoclasm: well now they show in the memorisation list
21:03:16 <elliott> but if you use the freaky memorisation tab in tiles
21:03:19 <elliott> they're listed first but aren't otherwise marked
21:03:30 <elliott> it'd be nice if the veh spell had like a background or something to distinguish it as The Spell Vehumet Is Shoving In Front Of You
21:03:38 <elliott> (they're coloured lightblue in the M list)
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21:04:33 <ontoclasm> i can certainly make the background, but i'll have to poke around to figure out how to display it
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21:04:45 <ontoclasm> local tiles' tab thing is really weird
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21:05:34 <elliott> ontoclasm: yes... I poked at the code and it was inexplicable
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21:12:24 <Cheibriados> 03elliptic 07* 0.12-a0-1767-g14ac376: Allow memorizing a Vehumet gift even at 100% fail. 10(5 minutes ago, 1 file, 1+ 1-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=14ac3760d3ca
21:12:46 * Grunt waits for someone to make a joke about newveh and 100% fail...
21:12:50 <ontoclasm> i get this error when i try to build now:
21:13:01 <ontoclasm> tilereg-mem.cc: In member function 'virtual int MemoriseRegion::handle_mouse(MouseEvent&)':
21:13:01 <ontoclasm> tilereg-mem.cc:66: error: no matching function for call to 'learn_spell(const spell_type&, int&)'
21:13:17 <ontoclasm> do i just need to clean first or something
21:14:15 <Lightli> http://pastebin.com/CUZGcZDn
21:14:21 <Lightli> Where did I miss up
21:14:25 <Lightli> *mess
21:14:44 <elliptic> ontoclasm: no, it looks like I (with help from elliott) broke tiles compilation
21:15:03 <elliott> elliptic: I tested tiles compilation
21:15:12 <elliott> oh hmm
21:15:30 <elliott> if (learn_spell(spell, m_items[item_idx].special))
21:15:31 <Grunt> Lightli: where's the {?
21:15:31 <elliott> that should be
21:15:37 <elliott> if (learn_spell(spell))
21:15:39 <Grunt> Lightli: (what do you see wrong with it?)
21:15:42 <elliott> sorry, I reverted that change while reverting my other tiles stuff
21:15:45 <Lightli> Nothing
21:15:53 <Lightli> I was just asking if anyone else saw anything wrong
21:15:53 <elliott> elliptic: oh *that's* why it stored the .special
21:15:55 <elliott> hmm
21:15:59 <elliott> I should fix this stuff
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21:17:22 <elliptic> ontoclasm: fixed now
21:17:28 <Cheibriados> 03dolorous 07* 0.12-a0-1768-geb9c13a: Remove a magic number for Vehumet piety. 10(3 minutes ago, 1 file, 1+ 1-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=eb9c13a7464c
21:17:28 <Cheibriados> 03elliptic 07* 0.12-a0-1769-g5988946: Fix tiles compilation. 10(2 minutes ago, 1 file, 1+ 1-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=5988946c8c8e
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21:29:00 <Grunt> I would like to note that the current version of these chaos butterflies is hilarious.
21:31:28 <DracoOmega> What do they do?
21:31:49 <Grunt> They're surrounded by rain clouds, and occasionally spawn a twister.
21:32:12 <elliptic> sounds good
21:32:34 <ontoclasm> erm >.>
21:32:47 <ontoclasm> i want to do something extremely hackish, is this a good idea y/n
21:32:53 <Grunt> ontoclasm: /
21:32:56 <Grunt> ontoclasm: explain!
21:33:21 <ontoclasm> oh
21:33:25 <ontoclasm> nm, it wouldn't work
21:33:33 <ontoclasm> i guess i have to screw with enums
21:33:59 * Grunt ponders who else is around that might be able to come up with monster tiles.
21:34:49 <ontoclasm> man, anyone can do pixel art
21:34:55 <ontoclasm> you just have to believe in yourself
21:39:11 <ontoclasm> okay, i think i figured out how to do it
21:39:21 <ontoclasm> what can i call to find out if a spell is from vehumet?
21:39:29 <Grunt> "man, anyone can do pixel art[...]okay, I think I figured out how to do it"
21:39:30 <Grunt> <_<
21:40:00 <elliott> ontoclasm: (spell == you.vehumet_gift)
21:40:09 <elliott> maybe there should be a function for it but there ain't
21:43:12 <ontoclasm> enums make me nervous
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21:43:21 <Grunt> How so?
21:43:31 <ontoclasm> i assume i'm screwing something up
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22:06:15 <Gretell> Debian builds of the trunk branch on crawl.develz.org updated to: 0.12-a0-1769-g5988946
22:09:59 * Grunt puts together some really basic tiles for the uniques and sets the chaos butterfly to cycle through the regular butterfly tiles like a chaos spaw...
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22:13:03 <Cheibriados> 03ontoclasm 07* 0.12-a0-1770-g527d90b: Memorise ability tile 10(75 minutes ago, 1 file, 0+ 0-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=527d90b74b01
22:13:03 <Cheibriados> 03ontoclasm 07* 0.12-a0-1771-gdeb6738: Hilight Vehumet gifts in the tiles mem. tab 10(5 minutes ago, 4 files, 12+ 0-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=deb67384cce2
22:13:57 <ontoclasm> We have secured the enemies' intelligence.
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22:31:41 <Grunt> ...very lame tiles: http://dl.dropbox.com/u/5494313/jorgrun.png and http://dl.dropbox.com/u/5494313/lamia.png
22:32:16 <Grunt> I like the chaos butterfly as a colour-cycling butterfly.
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22:40:36 * Grunt bothers ontoclasm.
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22:40:48 <ontoclasm> O-o
22:41:00 <ontoclasm> those look good
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22:50:17 <Grunt> Mm.
22:50:23 <Grunt> I guess it's showtime, then.
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22:53:29 <Cheibriados> 03Grunt 07* 0.12-a0-1772-gfdab6a4: New unique: Jorgrun, the dwarven earth elementalist. 10(5 months ago, 7 files, 86+ 0-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=fdab6a44a45e
22:53:29 <Cheibriados> 03Grunt 07* 0.12-a0-1773-g257c0c8: New unique: Lamia, as a naga queen. 10(3 hours ago, 10 files, 89+ 1-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=257c0c8c3d78
22:53:29 <Cheibriados> 03Grunt 07* 0.12-a0-1774-g4dc38f5: Chaos butterflies! 10(10 hours ago, 10 files, 73+ 7-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=4dc38f5e80f0
22:53:29 <Cheibriados> 03Grunt 07* 0.12-a0-1775-g488e642: Tiles for Jorgrun and Lamia; use colour-cycling butterfly for chaos butterfly. 10(15 minutes ago, 5 files, 13+ 0-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=488e6427bb00
22:53:29 <Cheibriados> 03Grunt 07* 0.12-a0-1776-g4627f03: Don't ignore chaos butterflies by default for autoexplore purposes. 10(14 minutes ago, 1 file, 1+ 1-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=4627f0385149
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22:56:03 <MarvinPA> if jorgrun is a deep dwarf shouldn't he have M_NO_REGEN?
22:56:14 <Grunt> ...>:|
22:56:24 <Grunt> I swear that was there when I looked earlier...
22:57:33 <Grunt> Thanks for noticing that, MarvinPA.
22:57:57 <MarvinPA> :)
22:58:01 <MarvinPA> and yay for chaos butterflies
22:58:12 <elliptic> Grunt: pretty sure that lamia spellset is worse than the greater naga spellset
22:58:34 <Cheibriados> 03Grunt 07* 0.12-a0-1777-g6e4f3b7: Tag Jorgrun with M_NO_REGEN. 10(2 minutes ago, 1 file, 2+ 1-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=6e4f3b7e70de
22:58:42 <Grunt> elliptic: I'm open to suggestions for improving it; that's what ended up coming out of the discussion we were having when I was working on tihs.
22:58:45 <elliptic> since olgreb's is harmless
22:59:07 <elliptic> and mesmerise is harmless if you are not scared of her
22:59:17 <elliptic> and IOOD is probably worse than poison arrow
23:00:11 <elliptic> my suggestion: replace olgreb's with any other spell
23:00:23 <Grunt> I want *something* to cast Olgreb's. :b
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23:00:35 <DracoOmega> It is a very non-threatening spell
23:00:41 <ontoclasm> give her summon eyes
23:00:42 <elliptic> Grunt: don't put it in a late branch where most people bring rPois
23:00:46 <DracoOmega> Somewhat like having an adder biting you
23:00:57 <elliptic> if you want something to cast it, target it for around the same location as fannar
23:01:06 <Grunt> ontoclasm: I suggested miasma. That didn't go over very well. XD
23:01:12 <Grunt> (no, it was not a serious suggestion)
23:01:28 <elliptic> miasma sort of sounds good
23:01:58 <elliptic> but just going with poison arrow is probably best
23:02:12 <elliptic> I realize that greater nagas already have that, but it *is* the best poison spell in the game
23:02:20 <elliptic> and it does something against rPois
23:02:29 <DracoOmega> I think IOOD is sort of a scary combo with mesmerize, personally
23:02:36 <ontoclasm> just make her not poison-based at all
23:02:46 <elliptic> DracoOmega: there is some synergy, but random blink is still good against both
23:02:58 <ontoclasm> iood + slow might be neat
23:03:18 <ontoclasm> or heaven forbid, paralyze
23:03:32 <DracoOmega> For some reason, I feel like I'd give her a bow instead of attack spells, but what do I know? :P
23:03:40 <ontoclasm> portal projectile
23:03:54 <Grunt> Can I revive my old monster portal projectile implementation? >_>
23:04:27 <elliptic> nagas are not known for using ranged weapons
23:04:51 <elliptic> Grunt: how much AC does jorgrun get with stoneskin?
23:04:57 <Grunt> Let's find out...
23:05:08 <Grunt> (I calculated this at some point, but that's probably long gone.)
23:06:14 <DracoOmega> elliptic: Well no, but uniques do get some leeway
23:06:36 <Grunt> Monster stoneskin grants (HD/2) bonus AC; Jorgrun has 15 HD -> 7 AC, base AC 2, and a robe for an extra point or two, so 10-11 AC.
23:07:43 <elliptic> so it is 4 -> 11, okay
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23:18:47 <Cheibriados> 03dolorous 07* 0.12-a0-1778-g9dcb903: Fix indentation. 10(in the future, 1 file, 4+ 3-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=9dcb903cc952
23:19:31 <Grunt> ...dolorous, bringing us the style of the future!!!
23:19:44 <Grunt> (I meant to fix that when making the chaos butterfly changes, but it somehow slipped my mind.)
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23:23:51 <Cheibriados> 03ontoclasm 07* 0.12-a0-1779-g5601ff7: Flip something_under, new_stair 10(44 seconds ago, 2 files, 0+ 0-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=5601ff7d2e78
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23:32:24 <Eronarn> chaos butterfly? <3
23:32:31 <Grunt> Eronarn: yes!
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